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Comment: French workers strengthen culture of protest

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Leo23
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re: Comment: French workers strengthen culture of protest
Leo23   7/30/2009 9:33:32 AM
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Well i guess people who have protested so much will have more problems to find a job in France , at the same time they are not representing all the people who have been laid off recently in France. We just hear lot of noise from such a protest , but it is like those stories that people get fired in th US and then shot CEO and all staff : that is not the case for everyone .

jason2
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re: Comment: French workers strengthen culture of protest
jason2   7/23/2009 5:05:31 PM
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Yes it's true there are scientists opposing the mainstream scientific assessment of global warming but they ARE IN THE MINORITY. Just as scientists who believe in creationism or intelligent design are in the minority. And, as are folks who believe that the earth is flat, and the planets, sun and stars revolve around the earth, and that the moon landings were a NASA hoax, and so on and so forth.

Avagadro
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re: Comment: French workers strengthen culture of protest
Avagadro   7/23/2009 4:53:07 PM
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The issue of what the "bad guys" do in the financial world is a real problem. I agree. There was no oversight when the financial markets were crumbling and warnings that were sounded years before were ignored. I certainly don?t condone that sort of behavior. The problem is fairly simple - the solution is not. A sharp, energetic individual on Wall Street will always be ahead of government bureaucrats. These people will read the laws, find the loop holes, and create a mechanism to exploit their greed. They always have and they always will. What I don?t see is ANY OUTRAGE. No one takes a stand ? no one complains, no one calls or visits their congress-person. They simply fold their hands and say - what can I do? I won?t post what I would like for the punishment to be for these scumbags ? it would make my last post look very liberal. Comparing being rich to being happy ? now that is another topic. If one likes engineering (and most of us do), one has to understand that there are limits on the pay scales. But it is hard to put a price on happiness. If you like what you are doing and you are fired up in the morning and can?t wait to get to work (or you spent the night there ) then you are in a good place. I was on a plane and the President of North American BMW was sitting next to me. We discussed a lot of things on the flight, but the most profound quote from him was ?I see a lot of very unhappy rich people.? That sure made me feel better about my 1990 Ford Bronco with 275k miles. Re China, I have been there and done that a few times. The government doesn?t particularly care for instability, but that is not to say that it doesn?t exist. A few years back, the average wage was 400 dollars per year; I am sure it has improved and I expect that distribution was very bi-modal. Regardless, astute business people will find a way to exploit differentials in cost and if it means moving from FRANCE to CHINA, that could certainly happen. If the average worker in China made the same wage as a French worker, what would the Barkhausen Criteria for oscillation reveal for Chinese stability? For you global warming fans, try this site out for some new information. http://joannenova.com.au/globalwarming/the_skeptics_handbook_2-22_lq.pdf Peace Comrades

des eng
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re: Comment: French workers strengthen culture of protest
des eng   7/23/2009 4:22:24 PM
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You said: "As far as the "gap" between rich and poor, I am sick of hearing about it. If you want to work hard enough, you too can become rich. Otherwise, quit your complaining. When you want to work multiple jobs, chase multiple degrees, move all over the world / country for the right opportunities, etc., THEN you MIGHT be justified in complaining about the "gap." I am tired of seeing "rich people" clobbered by ridiculous taxes so that the lazy and incompetent can continue to be lazy and incompetent." Hey, I'm an electrical engineer, got into engineering because I LOVE IT, not because I wanted to get rich! And, I can say, I'm doing a darn good job at it, i.e., engineering and not getting rich :-). And, in pursuant of working on the best engineering projects, I worked full time and put myself through college (working multiple jobs) and grad school. In the couple of decades since I've been out of school and in the work area, I figure I've worked on average well over 50 hours per week (perhaps much more, but I don't want to come across like I'm exaggerating). I know I've slept in my office, ate more company paid for meals then I care to remember (with much appreciation!), etc. I've worked on the west coast and the east coast, all in pursuit of working on COOL engineering projects. I've worked in India also. So, I think that would qualify me as at least NOT being lazy and incompetent. So, I would hope someone would appreciate it that some engineers enjoy doing what they do NOT because of the money but because they are engineers at heart! Imagine a world were we ALL strove to become rich, we would all be putting ourselves in positions closer to the money, i.e., wall street, etc. But then, who would be left to "create", to "build", to "explore"? So, some people like to get rich and enjoy the gifts of living in this great country and all our infrastructure and support afforded by same. I have no problem with that. Only when it comes to the detriment of all, so are we closing in on that? Some people would say the rich and greedy have already put us there. (i.e., have you seen the news about risky lending practices, wall street, tarp, recession, record unemployment, etc.?)

Design Engineer XXX
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re: Comment: French workers strengthen culture of protest
Design Engineer XXX   7/23/2009 3:55:18 PM
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"and no instability there" in China? Woa, dude, get your head out of the sand, ever hear of "Tiananmen Square", or more recently what's going on with Uyghur residents in Xinjiang province, or ... Hey, if you like China so much I will gladly buy you a one way ticket! And not "ONE PIECE of evidence" the culprit of global warming is humanity based? What #@#&$% are you smoking? As far back as 2005 the consensus from many leading reputable scientific organizations was that the CO2 levels across the globe are the highest in 650,000 years! Well past and ice age. It's funny how liberals think that rich people work little for too much income, and conservatives think poor people don't work at all and hence are not deserving of any more. All I know is when a CEO of a Wall Street company was paid, on average, tens of millions in total compensation in 2008, and this same piece of work is taking my fricken tax dollars because of his inept or illegal behavior I fail to see how he should be valued at 100 or 1000 times more then a typical engineer.

Semiconductor Design Engineer
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Semiconductor Design Engineer   7/23/2009 3:09:38 PM
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Russ Bell, VP of Marketing huh - figures. A little cranky this morning are we - not have your coffee yet - Aye?. Well, I sure wont be inviting you to the next socialist fund raiser!

Avagadro
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re: Comment: French workers strengthen culture of protest
Avagadro   7/22/2009 7:43:57 PM
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Patrick38 You say... How is it possible to accept marginal packages while shareholders benefited a lot from our work in the past without any sharing? We all have to understand that this crisis is just a detail about what will happen in the future. The gap between rich people and people just asking enough to live decently is to high now and have to be reduced if we want to garantee social stability and prepare an acceptable future for our kids,especially in a period where environmental issues will have soon a big impact on our lives................... Unreal!!! The difference between shareholders and employees is simple - the shareholders take the risk by putting their money up to help your company continue to operate. Without the shareholders, you dont have a job - no investment- no jobs. As far as the "gap" between rich and poor, I am sick of hearing about it. If you want to work hard enough, you too can become rich. Otherwise, quit your complaining. When you want to work multiple jobs, chase multiple degrees, move all over the world / country for the right opportunities, etc., THEN you MIGHT be justified in complaining about the "gap." I am tired of seeing "rich people" clobbered by ridiculous taxes so that the lazy and incompetent can continue to be lazy and incompetent. Social stability - what gives one the right to become unstable based on his or her position in the wealth hierarchy? That is the most ridiculous concept. There are 1+ billion Chinese that will gladly take your job and no instability there. What part of this dont you understand? And finally, environmental issues. Presumably, you are referring to greenhouse gases, or CO2 specifically. I would encourage you to find ONE PIECE of evidence that the culprit for the warming in the environment is CO2. I can refer you to several pieces of info to help you work through this. The science isnt there. It is generally agreed that the planet is warming, but it is NOT agreed that CO2 is the problem. During the ice age, the concentration of CO2 was 10x today's concentration. So, something is wrong. Dont start asking for CAP and TRADE from me; I dont buy it and it is simply another tax to slow down the US economy. The world has changed. Get over it and get on with your life and quit complaining.

Paul Simon
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re: Comment: French workers strengthen culture of protest
Paul Simon   7/14/2009 5:21:08 PM
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These arguments which border along "we must be as lambs and baa to every demand from the Corporates otherwise boo-hoo they will move elsewhere and we will lose our jobs" is very amusing. They are usually made by self important folks who rate themselves too highly and believe that they are indispensable. They always whistle a different tune once they get laid off and their job goes to Bangalore or Gdansk. Corporations have really been succesful in dividing and conquering the engineers in this country and importing cartloads of H-1 aspirants and as a result they continue to drive salaries and benefits down till we are now competing with people in India, Poland and China. Perhaps "losing" would be a better mot juste here than "competing"? I worked in India for about 5 years. Indian Labor law mandates certain benefits that MNCs wouldnt entertain here in our USA. These benefits came thanks to the long struggle of labour unions there - very similar to the French tradition. In USA, if you tried to get the same, they would be knocking on the door of their K-Street lobbyist before you could say "Free Market!". If you want to know how to ensure job stability and good pay then we have a ready made success story to study. Witness the American Medican Association, if you look closely at them, they are nothing but a very powerful Union in disguise for Doctors. They regulate, influence and control the profession so that at the end of the day, Supply is always < Demand and they always win. Any of you wonder why there is no H-1 program for Doctors? Well, there is, but no one can import Doctors into this country on H-1s like Corporations can with Engineers . A Doctor must already be here in the USA on a legal VISA and in order to apply for a job should have written and passed several tough certifying exams - its only after this that they can be sponsored by the employer for a H-1 and a Green Card. In fact, the AMA is so painstaking to prevent a glut of Doctors here that if you are a Doctor applying for a VISA to enter the USA then 9 out of 10 times you would be rejected. The ever present voice of the AMA reaches very far or should I say dollars?. This is the reason why a Nephrologist commands an average salary of around $300,000 or more per year. It seems to me that these Physicians are really clever chaps - they dont believe this apple sauce constantly served here about the Free Market. The demand and supply rule is what they go by. Maybe we could encourage the Doctors and the AMA to "think Globally", lets tell them, "hey, the market place has now become Global, you need to allow Doctors from everywhere to come here and compete". Thats what Intel and Cisco and IBM are constantly telling us. Wonder what these Whitecoats would reply to that. At least we might lower our health care cost some, ja? Wunderbar! it will prevent Socialized Medicine, ach gut!!

Semiconductor Design Engineer
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re: Comment: French workers strengthen culture of protest
Semiconductor Design Engineer   7/2/2009 3:24:12 PM
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Let them eat cake!

duncan idaho
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re: Comment: French workers strengthen culture of protest
duncan idaho   6/25/2009 10:00:09 AM
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patrick38 I think that you completely misunderstood the role of shareholders vs. the role of employees. Why would someone have to pay unprofitable business just because employees demand it? I bet you would change your mind if it came from your pocket ;). I live in France and I am very disapointed with lack of entrepreneurial spirit among French. The trend for France is not very positive. Lot of companies are closing and I don't think they will ever come back. So the tone of this article is right. No investment -> no jobs. From that perspective I guess that *your* kids will have problems to find a decent job unless they will be employed in public sector and paid by French government. I wouldn't bring that French revolution topic if I were you. This is something which resulted in killing a lot of people. I know what you are thinking. They all were bastards who deserved to be killed, right?

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