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London Calling: How to save Moore's Law

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krisi
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re: London Calling: How to save Moore's Law
krisi   10/11/2012 4:22:42 PM
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thank you @rf_austin...can you mention where that paper can be found?...or email me? kris.iniewski@gmail.com

TanjB
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re: London Calling: How to save Moore's Law
TanjB   10/11/2012 5:11:46 PM
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There is the other Moore's law: cost per acre of finished chip remains constant. In some ways these are dual. As ways are found to reduce dimensions, and if that delivers functional benefits, then there will be a tendency to aim for similar costs to cram more function into the same size. But as factors like power density, leakage, and other limits tend to eliminate the advantage of making smaller chips we could see a trend to making cheaper chips. After all, the Si only costs a few cents per sq cm. If it starts to make sense to produce each sq cm more cheaply (and tricks like vertical connection allow us to package them small and keep connection distance low) then we will continue to see increased functionality at falling cost. Just like we have had tremendous functionality and even performance growth since GHz scaling stalled a decade ago, we will continue to see functional and performance growth for a long time even if feature size stalls. The ingenuity and competition will simply shift into other dimensions.

Andrzej11
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re: London Calling: How to save Moore's Law
Andrzej11   10/11/2012 7:19:50 PM
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Hi Kris, Here's a link for Gordon's paper, http://av.r.ftdata.co.uk/files/2012/08/IS-U.S.-ECONOMIC-GROWTH-OVER-FALTERING-INNOVATION-CONFRONTS.pdf In my opinion, Gordon is way to pessimistic and his 100 year forecast just doesn't add up. He sounds like Hansen back in the 1930's who, with the passage of time, was proven wrong as well. Andrzej

krisi
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re: London Calling: How to save Moore's Law
krisi   10/11/2012 7:46:36 PM
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thank you Andrzej!

krisi
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re: London Calling: How to save Moore's Law
krisi   10/11/2012 7:49:09 PM
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Few cents per sq cm? that is too low..a sq cm silicon chip will definately cost way more than that

markhahn0
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re: London Calling: How to save Moore's Law
markhahn0   10/11/2012 7:53:16 PM
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let's remember our history a little better: ML is not solely responsible for getting us this far. lots of design progress has let us use those extra devices: 16-32-64, onchip caches, pipelining, OOO, even multicore (surely the least creative way to sop up the area/gates!) what's really changed is that devices/area isn't the main concern any more. faster is always better, but now power efficiency is the primary driver (not that it was ever far from the front!)

Bert22306
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re: London Calling: How to save Moore's Law
Bert22306   10/11/2012 8:07:11 PM
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Exactly! There was plenty of innovation before Moore's Law, and there will no doubt be plenty afterwards too. I don't understand this fascination with this single metric.

krisi
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re: London Calling: How to save Moore's Law
krisi   10/11/2012 8:13:36 PM
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Historically the gains due to innovation are much smaller than due to Moore's law...you might not like it but your job was likely thanx to it (or more precisely economics behind it)

grzy
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re: London Calling: How to save Moore's Law
grzy   10/11/2012 11:29:54 PM
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The nature of Moores Law scaling is such that many of the proposed substitutes just don't cut it. Any incremental and most likely one time gains from 3d chips or carbon nanotubes or anything like that, pales in comparision to the gains in going from 180nm to 90nm to 45 nm etc. Economicly this will be bad and we will go into a tech "dark ages" as there will be few new developments to spur investment and economic growth. Simply put why develop a new chip, if the new one cannot offer any more features? It ripples from there into vast swaths of the economy. We may get a short term bump in EE employment as the big players try to out design each other, but in the end the gains from doing that will by minimal. I think Intel knows this and that is way they are diversifying via there foundry ops to grap as much of the market share as possible when we get to the end.

any1
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re: London Calling: How to save Moore's Law
any1   10/12/2012 12:57:13 AM
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Some of the predictions on this board seem overly dire to me. While the growth of vanilla CMOS ICs may slow somewhat, human imagination is not bound by Moore's law. There will be new technologies and new applications of existing technology to drive the economy.

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