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TSMC says equipment vendors late for 14-nm

9/7/2011 10:08 AM EDT
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resistion
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re: TSMC says equipment vendors late for 14-nm
resistion   9/7/2011 12:30:50 PM
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I think tsmc will be ok with DP if the volume per mask goes up a lot. This will happen if they gain market share against GF and Samsung. Otherwise, if market share loss is imminent, maskless would give them more agility.

resistion
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re: TSMC says equipment vendors late for 14-nm
resistion   9/7/2011 1:58:00 PM
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I should say market share meaning more customers giving 100% business to tsmc.

Or_Bach
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re: TSMC says equipment vendors late for 14-nm
Or_Bach   9/7/2011 10:20:53 PM
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More volume is not always make it better, some times it just means that you are going to loose more. Cost of next generation device could be less attractive if you account the true cost of capital -throughput - and yield. As the issues with the classic 0.7x scaling are mounting up it seems that the industry should make serious effort to explore the monolith 3D IC alternative. In fact I have no doubts that future progress needs to incorporate scale up if only to extend the useful life of the accelerating costs associated with next generation lithography.

resistion
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re: TSMC says equipment vendors late for 14-nm
resistion   9/8/2011 12:52:30 AM
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I agree the NGL is still not cost effective enough. But how does double patterning compare with stacking two wafers? It seems you still consume twice as much silicon area with stacking.

Or_Bach
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re: TSMC says equipment vendors late for 14-nm
Or_Bach   9/8/2011 3:41:41 AM
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Yes it appears so but it is not so. If we can stack two layers with rich vertical connectivity (monolithic 3D)you reduce by ~50% your average gate length which allow the average gate size (W/L) to be about 50% smaller which result in 50% reduction of active silicon area (Yes those repeaters and drive do consume area). Please feel free to use the IntSim v2.0 an open-source simulator available at http://www.monolithic3d.com/simulators.html to evaluate alternatives of device implementations and the implication on die size power and performance. And you get additional saving on equipment amortization cost, mature line yield and far lower masks cost.

rfab
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re: TSMC says equipment vendors late for 14-nm
rfab   9/8/2011 4:04:21 AM
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1 think you"re tsmc"s pr

resistion
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re: TSMC says equipment vendors late for 14-nm
resistion   9/8/2011 8:32:39 AM
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Ok, just asking, not judging. Counting process steps is a serious exercise. I will take a look at your simulators, thanks.

resistion
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re: TSMC says equipment vendors late for 14-nm
resistion   9/8/2011 8:39:02 AM
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This article was about tsmc, so I used tsmc as subject. I think GF is also investigating maskless (same reasons).

resistion
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re: TSMC says equipment vendors late for 14-nm
resistion   9/8/2011 8:52:47 AM
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So I have 2 GB DRAM by stacking 1GB on another one. But I still patterned a 1GB die twice.

RobDinsmore
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re: TSMC says equipment vendors late for 14-nm
RobDinsmore   9/8/2011 4:20:53 PM
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I don't understand why foundries/ logic companies keep talking about 450mm for 2015. I mean yeah, I get it, but it is pure fantasy at this point because nobody in the capital equipment industry has jumped in to support this yet and it will take a few years to get to the point where fabs can start developing their full flows and then the usual 2 until that flow is ready to ramp. I work in the industry and every time a colleague asks management about 450mm we get the same story they are telling the press. Namely that 450mm needs investment from customers or some yet to be decided collaboration to make it cost effective for equipment vendors.

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