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Report: TSMC mulls New York investment

12/28/2011 06:40 PM EST
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Barry Liu
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re: Report: TSMC mulls New York investment
Barry Liu   12/29/2011 1:31:12 AM
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Yankee go home! Yes, that is a first step in the right direction. Not only the state of New York begins to change course from shuffling paper to creating money, i.e., from Wall Street economy or high finance industry to main street economy or high tech industry, but also the NYC under Mayor Bloomberg's leadership begins to press on the creation of Silicon Valley Plus version (a new high-tech engineering campus )in the Brooklyn borough. Yes, Yankee go home. Without industrial might, the US is nothing more than a "paper" tiger.

phoenixdave
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phoenixdave   12/29/2011 2:50:57 AM
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Very interesting development considering the investment NY has made into the Globalfoundries facility.

KB3001
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re: Report: TSMC mulls New York investment
KB3001   12/29/2011 1:11:01 PM
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This is the answer to those who criticised the new planned NY tech campus! Yes, taxpayer money will be spent but the potential return in the long run are much higher.

resistion
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re: Report: TSMC mulls New York investment
resistion   12/29/2011 2:25:37 PM
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New York is way more expensive than Taiwan. I guess could be a way to gain US support in cross-strait issues.

Barry Liu
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Barry Liu   12/29/2011 4:12:21 PM
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There is only "one Taiwan, one China" issue. The term, "cross-strait", is akin to a proun (or substitution to that effect) of a shotgun marriage. An independent, democratic,and strong Taiwan will be a blessing to American security and prosperity.

ibm221
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re: Report: TSMC mulls New York investment
ibm221   12/30/2011 12:50:58 AM
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yeah, when china get stronger wealthier, you twnese will beg to return to the other side of strait to get security and prosperity. like pueto rico case.

chipmonk0
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re: Report: TSMC mulls New York investment
chipmonk0   12/29/2011 7:30:12 PM
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Whats TSMCs motivation for locating a Fab in the US ?

SiliconAsia
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SiliconAsia   12/29/2011 11:50:30 PM
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None whatsoever! GF may have presence in NY but does not mean thaqt they are a threat to TSMC. So far they have not demonstrate their ability to execute. You can not run fabs globally speading out so many different places. TSMC has a fab in Seattle and it has been a nightmare for them. It's better for foundries to have as few sites as possible for better efficiency.

ibm221
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re: Report: TSMC mulls New York investment
ibm221   12/30/2011 12:47:16 AM
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If there is any, 1. tw is so tiny, it has run out of resources(human wise),if it keep on building fabs in tw and fill with tier 3,4 eng it will be performing like one of it's DRAM fabs. 2. tsmc can't build advanced fab in mainland china. 3. sansung's austin fab is doing just cool and a threat to tsmc.

resistion
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re: Report: TSMC mulls New York investment
resistion   12/30/2011 5:15:57 AM
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Surprised India didn't invite, with their recent fuss about getting started up in semiconductors.

ReneCardenas
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re: Report: TSMC mulls New York investment
ReneCardenas   1/1/2012 12:11:31 AM
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I had similar thoughts, more economical, closer and possibly higher numbers to select from when it comes to unemployed pool. This move could be political courtship to gain favors. I am just saying.

ashleyhaslstead
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ashleyhaslstead   12/30/2011 8:00:56 AM
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daleste
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re: Report: TSMC mulls New York investment
daleste   12/31/2011 11:55:38 PM
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That is interesting that TSMC would put a fab in New York. Seems like they would be better off putting it in a place like Austin or Dallas that has the engineering talent and a much lower cost of living.

ReneCardenas
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ReneCardenas   1/1/2012 12:15:31 AM
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Daleste, that would make too much sense (I agree, Texas has MUCH lower costs, and abundance of trained engineers), IMHO this move reads like a political tainted deal.

matt_kane21
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re: Report: TSMC mulls New York investment
matt_kane21   1/1/2012 8:06:07 AM
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Honestly, I doubt this. TSMC already owns several acres on which their WaferTech LLC Subsidiary operates in Washington state. They own enough land and have enough energy and water infrastructure on the campus to set up another fab. Not to mention the entire industry from wafer manufacturing, design and engineering, tool vendors, and shipping/freight is already in place. With local universities setting up programs for, or already putting out thousands of engineers a year there is an abundance in the area of skilled workers. There are better and cheaper options then setting up a new fab in New York.

PJames
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re: Report: TSMC mulls New York investment
PJames   1/6/2012 3:48:59 AM
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Perhaps the prospects of 8.0 earthquakes might be one factor weighing against Washington state.

matt_kane21
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matt_kane21   1/9/2012 7:28:45 AM
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TSMC wholly owns the campus in Washington. Earthquakes are a fact of life, and even more so in Taiwan, where TSMC operates 8+fabs. In the 15years wafertech has been in operation it has only shutdown due to seismic activity once for an earthquake 200 miles away. All fabs have seismic sensors that shut down equipment and hazmat lines the instant seismic activity is detected. So really, its a non issue. The only way I see TSMC going through with a new York fab is if the state and another company foot the majority of the startup money. That was how they got wafertech started, that's how they got TSMC-China started, that's how they got all of their non-taiwanese fabs off the ground.

aarunaku
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re: Report: TSMC mulls New York investment
aarunaku   1/2/2012 12:44:02 AM
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Everything is not about cost, if that was the case, probably Africa would be good for starting this. Recently, there was an announcement of NY state funding for 450mm wafers in upstate NY. This being a joint venture with the top semiconductor companies, it makes sense why TSMC is interested in upstate NY. Second reason, what about shrinking design rule's manufacturing challenges? We are talking few 100s of atom layers now! Where do we get the talent? Upstate colleges offer programes which are very attractive for semiconductor business. Some one should think why this counter intuitive.. Lastly, for India..wait for the anti-corruption bill to be fully functional, I am recording the date to and happy to prove myself wrong if it happens in the near future.

resistion
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re: Report: TSMC mulls New York investment
resistion   1/2/2012 7:37:27 AM
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TSMC already participates in 450 consortium, they don't need to pay more. NY doesn't hold a monopoly on talent either. Maybe pretense.

Robotics Developer
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Robotics Developer   1/2/2012 8:29:18 PM
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I too wonder why NY state and not Maine, Vermont, Texas, Idaho. All these are possible locations with some talent and low costs. If NY state has deeper pockets that allow better incentives then that would make sense. I would think that there has to be cheaper locations (worldwide) so it must be more than cost driven, most likely politics and incentives.

krisi
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re: Report: TSMC mulls New York investment
krisi   1/2/2012 9:19:33 PM
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To @aarunaku and others: it is always about the cost...but broadly understood...finding the right people is cost too...if NY pulls this off it would be amazing...Kris

Hongster
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Hongster   1/3/2012 5:13:34 PM
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Who could have thought of Silicon valley east in New York? It's happening folks. Anything is possible now.

pinhead1
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re: Report: TSMC mulls New York investment
pinhead1   1/3/2012 7:50:51 PM
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Guys, this is *Albany*, not Manhattan. Cost of living is higher than, say, Kentucky - but it's not as much of an issue as you're making it out to be. You can have a great life in Albany on an engineer's salary.

aarunaku
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re: Report: TSMC mulls New York investment
aarunaku   1/3/2012 10:09:05 PM
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There are a lot of interesting comments. One thing we have to observe here is, solid state transistor first appeared in east coast but Si valley is CA (how many fabs?). If some one looks at the fabs in the US, it is in ID, UT, VA, OR, TX, WA, NY, ME, AZ, NM and some old and small fabs elsewhere. Intel moved to OR long back, is a great example. It is debatable about the cost of living in NY, but upstate NY =/= Manhattan. It is very rural, lots of snow in winter etc., like places where most of other fabs are! I agree with another comment here, living in Albany as an engineer is not bad at all. Whatever we debate here, it is helpful to have a fab making sub nanometer devices with great precision. Let us encourage the enterprise.

matt_kane21
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re: Report: TSMC mulls New York investment
matt_kane21   1/9/2012 7:45:03 AM
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The amount of semiconductor companies operating out of the Portland Oregon area is pretty crazy, and TSMC already owns and operates a fab there. They hold the record as that fab is the largest pure-play fab in the US. Not to mention HP operates two campuses there, linear technologies operates a fab there, shin-etsu, the largest volume wafer manufacturer in the world operates a plant and has their American hq there, the list goes on. However, if they setup another fab in America, I doubt they will be working on sub-Micron nodes. It's much cheaper to manufacture the sub-Micron technologies in the already-established Taiwan gigafabs. The only way you will see a sub-Micron fab owned by TSMC in America is if TI, Apple, and AMD foot the bill, as they are TSMC's biggest submicron customers.

geekmaster
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re: Report: TSMC mulls New York investment
geekmaster   1/6/2012 5:23:49 PM
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This is not the first time that I hear rumors about TSMC looking into building a fab upstate New York. The first time was when Luther Forest in Malta was looking for companies. TSMC owns a lot of land in Taiwan and just bought more land (Dec 2011). Only if there are huge incentives (better than Taiwan), it makes sense for TSMC to build a fab there. Can New York state offer these incentives?

krisi
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re: Report: TSMC mulls New York investment
krisi   1/6/2012 5:28:23 PM
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TSMC has to built fabs outside Taiwan, imagine what would happen to their business (and to many other big companies) if there was a strong earthquake there...but whether it will be in New York, Brasil, Poland or North Pole that is another story...Kris

PJames
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re: Report: TSMC mulls New York investment
PJames   1/6/2012 5:38:53 PM
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I think you mean "imagine what will happen when".

Lee Harrison
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re: Report: TSMC mulls New York investment
Lee Harrison   1/9/2012 8:23:25 PM
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As a poster named "pinhead" said: "Guys, this is *Albany*, not Manhattan." The fact that so many posters here are talking about Bloomberg and new York City etc ... obviously oblivious. Also an "investment in the state" hardly means a FAB, even though the author "presumes" this is what is being discussed. It might well be a design/RD center, associated with the the cluster of such there around Nanotech/Sematech2. Or, as to why TSMC might locate a fab in the US I can only speculate, but once that decision to do so is made, for whatever reason, then locating in an area of burgeoning fab installations does likely ease permitting, support resources, and access to trained personnel ... at least until the cumulative impact and drain of these fabs starts to strain local resources and carrying capacity. Having Global Foundries and TSMC "right across the street" from each other would be amusing, but plausible for the same reasons gas-stations are often all clustered around a very few street corners. But then again .., no real story until TSMC actually does it. Folks can stop hyperventilating.....

ChrisGar
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re: Report: TSMC mulls New York investment
ChrisGar   1/18/2012 11:42:17 PM
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"Tax breaks" can have huge impact on costs & profit. I'd guess this is part of the discussion. Also, the concern about earthquakes are very real. There is no way a fab can be "earthquake proof." Doing something like sensing the earthquake and turning off tools can be the worst thing that could happen to ICs during certain processing steps. Probably 75% of engineers who support fabs do not have to be local to that fab. They are mainly looking at data and providing support that can be done remotely. Many engineers support multiple fabs that are spread across the global in this way.

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