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8/8/2014 11:22 AM EDT
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pclu168
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Re: Yield data
pclu168   11/16/2014 3:35:02 AM
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The one comes with higher yield number does mean better progress than others, as similar amount of area saving in 16/14FF from its prior node have to given. The difference from those older nodes which usually you can estimate how long it will take to reach high enough yield, is that for 16/14FF you will not how long it is going to take to bridge the gap if the design of the process is not right in first place - gate last and gate first in 28/32nm is an example.

Gondalf
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Re: Yield data
Gondalf   11/14/2014 4:05:31 PM
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Rick, do you remember the TSMC 28nm ramp?? i think yes :).

I pretty believe we must to be very cautious about what TSMC says. In this moment is a war to catch more customers than competitors but this does not mean that things are going well.

IMO TSMC will have the same Samsung issues ramping in production, both have the same tools and the same scanners from Nikon and ASLM. There is a litographic issue around and nobody can do much in front of this, but only do slow slow improvements. Intel apparently is seriously thinking about EUV at the middle of the 10nm ramp, this is a sign that we are all running out of gas with these old steppers.

Apple and Qualcomm know this and are looking at ALL companies available, to have the insurance of an acceptable no broken dies output. TSMC sells on wafer basis not of good dies basis. It seems to me a russian roulette for big customers.

I have the suspect we will have some (bad) surprises on these new nodes. I like who say: long life to older and proven nodes :). 

Mr. FA
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Re: Yield data
Mr. FA   11/14/2014 1:41:56 PM
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Which is better; 90% SRAM yield on a 8Mb SRAM or 30% yield on a 256Mb SRAM? Without knowing the SRAM size yield #'s are worthless.

Similarly comparing product yield of 90% on a 10mm2 die vs 5% yield on a 500mm2 die, which is better?  

 

Without memory size or die size,  yield reporting is worthless.  It's why many industry yield engineers talk in D0 or defect density which is normalized.  The problem with D0 is there are different ways to calculate, so company A and company B may calculate differently

Marketing is awesome.

 

 

rick merritt
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Re: Yield data
rick merritt   11/14/2014 11:38:55 AM
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@Physiker How do you kow the 90% yield number for TSMC is only for SRAM not the process overall?

Physiker
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Re: Yield data
Physiker   11/14/2014 10:34:33 AM
The TSMC 90 % yield reported in the article is only SRAM yield. And the number is pretty meaningless without stating the size of the SRAM.

It shows that TSMC has 16 nm yield but it is not a number you can compare with any other.

HS_SemiPro
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Is Samsung SRAM same size as TSMC SRAM?
HS_SemiPro   11/14/2014 1:28:47 AM
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Is Samsung SRAM same size as TSMC SRAM? IF so what size of SRAM are they talkign about? Is this perfect Yield or yield with redundancy? IS this 1 time demo or Avg. Yield.?

 

It is hard to compare yield without knowing above details.

 

 

daleste
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Re: Yield data
daleste   11/13/2014 9:53:53 PM
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Yes, they usually keep yield information confidential.  It is a huge difference between the companies if it is correct.  I can see why the big customers may be interested in talking to TSMC.

rick merritt
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Yield data
rick merritt   11/13/2014 7:28:19 PM
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TSMC at 90%+ yields with 16nmFF and Samsung at 30-35%? That would be huge.

It's rare to see yield data...is it accurate?

AZskibum
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GPU Computing reaching mainstream
AZskibum   8/11/2014 9:43:10 AM
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It looks like GPU computing has become mainstream and is an increasingly important market segment. Great news for GPU makers and for application developers.

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