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Apple Owes $14.5 Billion Back Tax, says Europe

8/30/2016 07:45 PM EDT
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ciaranmaca
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Rookie
Apple Deal Stinks (So does my Irish government)
ciaranmaca   9/1/2016 11:01:24 AM
NO RATINGS
Everything about this is rotten, but who can believe that Apple and Ireland are unique. The reality is that as big corporations have globalised they have pursued tax avoidance more aggressively and more successfully. No doubt the way globalisation has let them scale their markets and power has given them more resistance to the meagre efforts by governments to make them pay a fair share. In Ireland's case there is always the veiled threat that, 'hey you are a small country, heavily dependent on FDI for jobs, if you don't give us a top deal, those jobs might dissappear'. Even those of us who support a low tax regime for corporations here in Ireland, abhor the 'no tax' regime that is the reality. Is it too much to hope that, as western populations age and crave more services for health, education etc, they will push all the harder on governments to break the corporate tax evasion scandal? But this cannot be done while governments refuse to co-operate on these matters. I thought it pathetic that the American Treasury got stuck in the middle of this one saying Europe is out to get American companies. Hang on, Apple just made 22bn profits (not sales, profits I stress) in Europe and paid practially zero tax. Awe poor apple. And for Tim Cook to pour out his indignation. Yes, Mr. Cook, to use your own words this is 'political crap'. The whole deal is political crap, and stinks like crap. I hope this scandal, and it is a scandal, keeps the issue of corporate taxation in the public mind. Please folks, let's not let this one drop off the radar with the next manufactured news story. 

Ciaran Mac

Dublin

dt_hayden
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Author
Re: sweetheart deal
dt_hayden   9/1/2016 10:19:30 AM
NO RATINGS
You are right, that was merely meant to debunk the "lower taxes creates job" myth.  In fact, I have no doubt the greedy weasels at Apple would shop their company elsewhere to avoid paying taxes, because 12.5% is outrageous, right?

Kevin Neilson
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Re: sweetheart deal
Kevin Neilson   8/31/2016 5:02:04 PM
NO RATINGS
You make the assumption that Apple would have continued to do business in Ireland if they'd had to pay $14.5b in taxes.  They may have gone elsewhere, in which case there would've been no benefit to Ireland.  It's also not the job of a government to maximize its own revenue.  

dt_hayden
User Rank
Author
Re: sweetheart deal - yup, they're bad
dt_hayden   8/31/2016 12:34:07 PM
"This happens a lot in the US, too, with typically the same dismal results - and there's a name for it: crony capitalism."

I live in a staunchly Republican state.  you are preaching to the choir.

 

I also read elsewhere that, in fact, this situation was good for the US and the US govt was threatening the EU not to pursue it.  The argument there was that by forcing Apple to pay the appropriate back taxes in Ireland, it would reduce the taxes already paid in the US, allowing for a refund for taxes already paid.  I beleive that conflicts with this report stating that the majority of profits were assigned to a stateless entitiy with no resulting taxes paid.

TonyTib
User Rank
Author
Re: sweetheart deal - yup, they're bad
TonyTib   8/31/2016 12:01:28 PM
Ireland didn't lower taxes on everyone - instead, they gave Apple a special, sweetheart deal, which wasn't a good deal for the taxpayers.  This happens a lot in the US, too, with typically the same dismal results - and there's a name for it: crony capitalism.  

(Some examples include stadium financing for billionaires, special deals for fabs (pretty sure GloFlo and ams got some special deals from NY), and such).

 

dt_hayden
User Rank
Author
sweetheart deal
dt_hayden   8/31/2016 11:10:50 AM
I read elsewhere that part of this sweetheart deal involved Apple locating an iMac assembly plant with 6000 workers in Cork.  For an approximation, $14.5 billion over 12 years and 6000 employees is about $200K per job per year.  So it looks like the claim that lower taxes creates jobs is true, just extremely inefficiently.  It would be way more effective to have companies pay the taxes owed, employ those 6000 people for infrastructure improvements, medical assistants, etc, and still have $10.2 billion left over.  (assuming $60k per job).

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