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amigabill2
I look at it that scientists figure out how to do things by figuring out how ...
GeorgeSand
Scientist vs Engineer
Naomi Price
6/1/2012 9:19 AM EDT
So far in the Define Yourself contest, we've examined the terms "Engineer" and "Hacker." (iGEN kids have voted and you can see the winning definitions for "Engineer" here.)
A few comments that came up while defining Engineer brought up an interesting question: What is the difference between a Scientist and an Engineer? The distinction may seem inherently clear to you, but I can guarantee you'll find a pretty blurry line (if any) when you ask kids.
Below are the definitions we already have, please continue to expound, explain and examine in the comments field below. The reader whose definition is deemed to be best by the kids will receive a certificate of brilliance designed by Daniel Guidera and full bragging rights! (we're in the process of arranging possible additional prizes for this contest...details to come)
From SarahCurry: "Scientists imagine the things that could be; engineers turn those things into reality"
From krwada: To Quote Freeman Dyson: "A good scientist is a person with original ideas. A good engineer is a person who makes a design that works with as few original ideas as possible. There are no prima donnas in engineering."
and from Denis.Giri: "Scientists think things up and test ideas & algorithms, Engineers transform those thoughts into specifications, plans and blueprints, and Technicians & Workers use the blueprints to make stuff."
A few comments that came up while defining Engineer brought up an interesting question: What is the difference between a Scientist and an Engineer? The distinction may seem inherently clear to you, but I can guarantee you'll find a pretty blurry line (if any) when you ask kids.
Below are the definitions we already have, please continue to expound, explain and examine in the comments field below. The reader whose definition is deemed to be best by the kids will receive a certificate of brilliance designed by Daniel Guidera and full bragging rights! (we're in the process of arranging possible additional prizes for this contest...details to come)
From SarahCurry: "Scientists imagine the things that could be; engineers turn those things into reality"
From krwada: To Quote Freeman Dyson: "A good scientist is a person with original ideas. A good engineer is a person who makes a design that works with as few original ideas as possible. There are no prima donnas in engineering."
and from Denis.Giri: "Scientists think things up and test ideas & algorithms, Engineers transform those thoughts into specifications, plans and blueprints, and Technicians & Workers use the blueprints to make stuff."
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jkdrum
6/1/2012 10:14 AM EDT
I would say engineers in general are scientists but scientists are not engineers. Engineers are practical scientists. We use the tools of science to perform our work. The term scientist is more broad.
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seaEE
6/1/2012 11:26 AM EDT
I think scientists are usually investigating the unknown. Engineers are typically assembling the "known" into a useful product.
Someone who does stress testing on an electrical or mechanical design is more of a scientist than an engineer.
My $.0314159 worth...
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Dr Mark
6/1/2012 1:38 PM EDT
This is easy: A scientist takes things appart (to investigate them), and an engineer puts things together (to build them).
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Steve.Heckman
6/1/2012 2:43 PM EDT
Then I was a really good scientist when I was a kid, though I still take thing apart to see what's inside.
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stuart.yaniger
6/1/2012 1:45 PM EDT
If you'll forgive a religious/cultural metaphor, scientists write the Torah, engineers write the Talmud.
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DU00000001
6/4/2012 2:55 PM EDT
To stick to this picture:
scientists equal the rabbi, engineers the believer.
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DarkMatter
6/5/2012 5:08 PM EDT
No need to apologise for a religious/cultural metaphor. It was most illuminating.
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OldEE
6/1/2012 1:49 PM EDT
When I was going to Caltech we had a description of the difference between an engineer, physicist and a mathematician. If a house was on fire an engineer would pour water on it until the fire was out. The physicist would calculate just how much water was required and then use just that much to see if he was correct. The mathematician would calculate just how much water was required then walk away because the problem was solved.
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Ecspansion
6/8/2012 4:12 PM EDT
I remember a similar story:
A trash can in the office is on fire. A Mathematician stops by and after writing some equations declares: "The solution exists". A Physicist stops by and after some calculations declares: "The solution is feasible". An Engineer shows up, gets a bucket of water and puts the fire out!
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David.Darling
6/1/2012 1:49 PM EDT
An engineer wants to make something work.
A scientist wants his work to lead to something else.
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BMC4Links
6/1/2012 1:52 PM EDT
Scientists study the world to tell you what can't be done. Engineers do it.
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flexeos
6/1/2012 2:59 PM EDT
scientist have to find the best answer to the question "how". engineers have to find the best trade off answering "how", "how much" and "how soon"
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IDontUseTheForumSoWhyAmIForcedToMakeANickname
6/1/2012 3:14 PM EDT
A scientist can take a concept and explain, in theory, how it should work. An engineer, on the other hand, is the one who gets to turn it into reality.
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Itinerant Engineer
6/1/2012 9:19 PM EDT
Scientists study parts of the universe, creating mathematical models describing what can and cannot be done. Engineers take the scientists' models (often from multiple disciplines) and find a way to achieve the same end as if the impossible were possible.
Consider meta-materials that behave as if they had a negative index of refraction. Negative indices of refraction are impossible, but the combination of resonant units at sufficiently small scales behave as if they did, for a given frequency range, without violating that principle.
Lance ==)--------------
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Redandgearhead
6/1/2012 4:07 PM EDT
Scientists figure out how the Universe works and engineers take that knowledge and figure out how to make our lives easier, safer, and more efficient.
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EREBUS
6/1/2012 4:51 PM EDT
To be a scientist, you need to understand engineering. To be an engineer, you need to understand the science.
In most cases, engineers study things to figure out how they work and disseminate that knowledge to others.
Engineers take the available knowledge and try to build things that benefit society or solve existing needs.
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jtdavies
6/1/2012 4:52 PM EDT
scientist produces paper
engineer produces thing
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EREBUS
6/1/2012 5:08 PM EDT
If you do not produce the paper then all of the effort and discoveries you make are lost until someone else with more discipline rediscovers your findings.
A GOOD engineer always documents his work!
A GOOD scientist has detailed notes documenting his ideas, experiments and results without fear of ridicule. Discovery is important business, but if you do not capture the information and the process, your efforts are wasted.
Just my opinion.
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MindTech
6/1/2012 6:15 PM EDT
Scientists ask the question, "Why does this work?"
Engineers ask the question, "How does this work?"
Scientist ask the question, "What can I learn from this?"
Engineers ask the question, "What can I make from this?"
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David Ashton
6/1/2012 7:28 PM EDT
A Scientist invented the transistor.
An Engineer used the transistor to make a radio.
A Scientist invented a way to put a bunch of transistors together to make an integrated circuit.
An Engineer put a bunch of integrated circuits together to make a computer.
The best results come when they work together. The engineer knows what he wants to do, the scientist finds him a way to do it.
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WKetel
6/1/2012 8:57 PM EDT
A good engineer knows how things work and he creates things that serve a purpose, and possibly make money.
A scientist wonders how things work, makes logical guesses about how they work, and then does experiments to see if they do work that way.
Of course, currently I see a lot of "scientists" making assertions about the universe that are totally non verifiable. So if they are completely wrong, nobody would ever be able to prove it.
A scientist can't begin to guess what was there 1 minute before the "big bang", an engineer would try to figure it out.
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resistion
6/2/2012 9:50 AM EDT
I hardly see "scientist" in a job title, except for maybe "chief scientist" or "lead scientist". But almost any technical job title includes "engineer".
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Rod Dalitz
6/3/2012 4:49 PM EDT
I will take this one step further: I believe that one can consider the technician, engineer, and scientist as a spectrum.
The scientist discovers new principles, and the best scientists are extremely valuable to society in the long term, for example, the discovery of electricity and semiconductors are essential to modern life. A good scientist may create enormous value but has little day-to-day responsibility.
The engineer makes use of scientific principles and empirical knowledge to devise new solutions to problems and to create new products, and is valuable in a medium term. He has considerable responsibility and targets to meet, within timescales longer than day-to-day.
The technician produces and operates these new products, and is equally valuable in the short term, designing the detailed product and running the factory efficiently. He has
In some cases, the value of the technician is recognised - a GP or Dentist mostly carries out standard procedures, which is a technician's task, and is well paid for it. Someone running a semiconductor fab is doing a high-level technician task, which I would not wish to give to an engineer and even less to a scientist.
The scientist may make 1000% changes, that is order of magnitude; engineers may make 100% changes; the technician may make 10% changes, which may be the difference between success ad failure of the rfinery or semi fab.
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Tloose
6/4/2012 8:09 AM EDT
A Scientist asks why something works;
an Engineer has to figure out why something doesn't work.
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DarkMatter
6/4/2012 2:23 PM EDT
A scientist discovers. An engineer invents.
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ndancer
6/4/2012 3:52 PM EDT
If man could fly, it would be the job of the scientist to explain how. Since he can't, it's the job of the engineer to make it possible.
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Bert22306
6/4/2012 4:40 PM EDT
Good posts!
I guess the spectrum is continuous, so in the real world, the differences are often not sharply defined. In principle, a scientist makes discoveries that may or may not lead to anything tangible. Where an engineer applies the knowledge.
But then take someone like Claude Shannon. How would you classify him? Among other inventions and discoveries, he derived what we call Shannon's Equation (relationship between channel capacity, noise, and bandwidth), which some might say is a scientist's or a mathematician's "job," but he studied EE at U Michigan and MIT. He did a lot of theoretical work in cryptography. All for real, practical purposes, but theoretical work nevertheless.
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KB3001
6/4/2012 6:29 PM EDT
One of my teachers used to say: Science is the study of God-made stuff, whereas Engineering is the study of man-mande stuff.
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gmsamaras_eet
6/4/2012 10:45 PM EDT
Being both a scientist and an engineer, I'd say that is as good an explanation as I've seen. I might want to modify that to "naturally-occurring stuff", but I think we all get the general idea.
GM Samaras Pueblo, CO
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KB3001
6/5/2012 4:03 AM EDT
I agree gmsamaras_eet, I just did not want to change my teacher's original quote :-)
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DarkMatter
6/5/2012 5:06 PM EDT
I prefer the original too.
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hithesh
6/5/2012 12:10 AM EDT
Engineer can be outsourced, scientist cannot be outsourced (yet).
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GordonScott
6/6/2012 10:24 AM EDT
Pragmatism.
An engineer must strive to produce, somehow, something that works sensibly in the real world. Engineers only occasionally get the opportunity to do pure research.
A scientist need not be so constrained. Scientists quite often get the opportunity to do pure research.
There are _huge_ overlaps between the two and huge ambiguities, particularly in sectors like industrial chemistry.
There are many very good and interesting answers on this page, though many of those also which I must dispute somewhat.
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Gruntmaster5000
6/29/2012 8:38 PM EDT
Good answer.
On a personal note: "Gordon Scott" were you once associated with an outfit known as the International Greenland Society or some such?
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peralta_mike
6/6/2012 1:02 PM EDT
Scientists derive the equations.
Engineers apply the equations.
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schmalisch
6/6/2012 1:04 PM EDT
I would say engineering is applied science.
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Canada
6/6/2012 1:30 PM EDT
Scientist is to discover/research unknowns.
Engineers creatively use kn-own discovered/researched by scientist to build useful products.
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Peter Gregson
6/6/2012 2:45 PM EDT
As a 30-year engineering prof, engneering-company founder and serial entrepreneur, I believe that scientists ask "How does this work?" while engineers ask "How can I use this to solve my problem?" Scientists want to understand the detailed physical principles, engineers exploit the materials using simplified models of those materials.
Peter Gregson
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Jerry.Brittingham
6/6/2012 3:04 PM EDT
An engineer is a scientist for pay.
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peralta_mike
6/6/2012 4:10 PM EDT
A Scientist uses his head.
An Engineer uses his head and hands.
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segunemmanuel
6/23/2012 9:16 AM EDT
the proofs and equations just dont lie in the head.
they are proved by the hand
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nosubject
6/6/2012 5:56 PM EDT
Science ask the question "what"
Engineer ask the question "How"
Philosophy ask the question "Why"
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David Ashton
6/7/2012 8:20 AM EDT
Sorry - this reminded me of old joke:
University Bean-Counter is complaining to the Dean of Engineering: "Why do you need all this expensive test equipment? Why can't you be like the Maths department - they only need a waste-paper basket?" Thinks for a few more seconds. "Or better still like the philosophy department, they don't even need the waste-paper basket?"
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nosubject
6/7/2012 10:46 AM EDT
Haha, that is the philosophy part, or "religion part". Why cannot we design by breathing?
"Why the light speed is a constant in the vacuum?"
"Why E=mc2 ?"
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segunemmanuel
6/23/2012 9:16 AM EDT
this is spot on
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peralta_mike
6/6/2012 7:49 PM EDT
1. Mathematicians create the language.
2. Scientists use the language to find the true rules.
3. Engineers use the true rules to make things.
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DSI-STI
6/6/2012 10:48 PM EDT
"Scientist creates a possibility, Engineer confirms it"
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jackOfManyTrades
6/7/2012 2:55 AM EDT
Scientists do science; engineers do engineering?
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Wnderer
6/7/2012 9:22 AM EDT
Galileo discovered the moons of Jupiter, but an engineer created the telescope.
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I_B_GREEN
6/7/2012 11:30 AM EDT
An engineer gets blamed for the product not working because the scientists theory did not hold water!
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I_B_GREEN
6/7/2012 11:32 AM EDT
or ... the engineer tweaks the theory so the design can work!
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BILL.FLANNERY
6/7/2012 1:43 PM EDT
MIT professor Steve Senturia is credited with the following definition:
"Engineering is the purposeful use of science"
If I could only come up with an equally good definition of 'science', we'd be done.
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joebryan
6/7/2012 1:52 PM EDT
Scientists figure out how reality works. Engineers use that information to modify reality.
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DaveWyland
6/7/2012 2:20 PM EDT
An engineer makes things work; a scientist explains why they work. The two play leapfrog together.
Engineering is empirical; science is theoretical.
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Tiger Joe
6/13/2012 5:53 PM EDT
Actually science is primarily empirical. It's based on experiment and observation to explain a theory. Engineering is applying science to come up a workable solution to practical problems.
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Martin Lowson
6/7/2012 3:17 PM EDT
“Scientists discover the world that exists; engineers create the world that never was."
— Theodore von Karman
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jaihind
6/8/2012 7:05 AM EDT
scientists are innovative
engineers are creative
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DK8PP/M
6/8/2012 10:53 AM EDT
Here is a quote from an unforgotten Engineer: "A scientist might be called a person who can show something working once. An engineer must figure out how to make products that will last considerably longer than the warranty period." (Bob Pease, Electronic Design 21.11.94)
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Frank Eory
6/8/2012 2:07 PM EDT
A scientist, an engineer and a mathematician are sharing a hotel room, when in the middle of the night they awaken to discover that the TV set is on fire.
The scientist grabs a pencil and paper and begins calculating the precise quantity of water required to put out the fire and the flow rate required to obtain that quantity of water from the bathroom faucet.
The mathematician grabs a pencil and paper and begins deriving a proof that it is possible to put out the fire.
The engineer grabs an empty trash can, runs to the bathroom and fills it with water, then dumps it onto the TV set, extinguishing the fire.
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Frank Eory
6/8/2012 4:19 PM EDT
Sorry for the redundancy. I should've read the comments above first!
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RWatkins
6/11/2012 10:39 PM EDT
Is it possible you forgot to mention that the Engineer UNPLUGGED the TV first?
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donald schulz
6/8/2012 4:34 PM EDT
Scientists answer questions;
e.g. "is there life on Mars?"
Engineers solve problems;
e.g. "Plan the most fuel efficient trajectory to place an instrument package on the north pole of mars."
To which his supervisor may add "and have the
details of the plan on my desk by this afternoon."
Don Schulz
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jf_tol
6/8/2012 4:54 PM EDT
Scientists observe nature. Engineers create what never was.
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prabhakar_deosthali
6/9/2012 2:42 AM EDT
Scientists are dreamers where as the engineers brings the dreams to reality.
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RWatkins
6/11/2012 10:44 PM EDT
Scientists create theories and hypotheses, and generate data to prove them. Conversely engineers create products and generate data testing them. Whereas the scientists' products are vetted by fellow scientists, engineers' products are vetted by customers.
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Dan.Rainge
6/15/2012 1:32 PM EDT
A Scientist attempts to understand the details of how the things in nature work that we manipulate, see, touch, taste, smell,and hear. An Engineer helps improve our lives by making things, technology, that takes advantage of the understanding and information that Scientists collect.
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jgruszynski2
6/15/2012 6:28 PM EDT
My take on the difference is:
* Scientist use the scientific method to discovery the "truth" and "workings" of nature
* Engineers use the scientific method and scientific knowledge to create technology for human benefit
It's a question of primary focus and emphasis. Obviously there is overlap - applied science is more like engineering while engineering research is more like the practice of science. But when you get down to it, it's the goals that are the difference.
To put it another way: a scientist can say "We don't know; there isn't a answer yet" to some question. An engineer never has that luxury so they would say "For the right amount of time and money, we can probably get an answer/solution/product".
Scientists, from my 30 years of engineering experience, do not generally create technologies and generally suck at the process of doing so. Technologies are the result of BOTH economic AND science knowledge and skills combined.
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QuailHillTony
6/18/2012 7:41 PM EDT
Engineers produce products
Scientist produce publiciations
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Professor Mankey
6/22/2012 4:34 PM EDT
Scientists test and extend the limits of knowledge. Engineers apply knowledge to enhance and improve our quality of life.
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Professor Mankey
6/22/2012 4:41 PM EDT
Scientists test and extend the limits of knowledge. Engineers apply knowledge to enhance and improve our quality of life.
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joao luiz
6/22/2012 4:56 PM EDT
Scientists are people who dream sweet dreams. Engineers are people that turn these dreams into reality. Usually, they become your nightmares.
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HATHA
6/23/2012 12:03 AM EDT
Engineer rely on Datasheet which made by Scientist,
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segunemmanuel
6/23/2012 9:18 AM EDT
SarahCurry is just so wrong.
Everyone imagines the future,
Scientist proofs possibilities
and only the scientifically proven can be engineered.
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segunemmanuel
6/23/2012 9:23 AM EDT
SarahCurry is just so wrong.
Everyone imagines the future,
Scientist proves the possibility
of the imagined.
and only the scientifically proven can be engineered.
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KigerZh
6/26/2012 2:41 AM EDT
I believe "Scientists study the world as it is, engineers create the world that never has been" . But them based on each other. Engineers are based on the theory from scientists; Scientists are based on the tools and equipments from egnineers.
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GeorgeSand
7/6/2012 6:56 PM EDT
Engineers enjoy a process, but focused on a result.
Scientists enjoy result, but all they care about is a process.
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amigabill2
7/11/2012 10:54 AM EDT
I look at it that scientists figure out how to do things by figuring out how things work. Engineers don't care how things work, they just implement practical usage of those things. I don't care how a diode works, I only care about what it does and what that can do for me, and how I make use of it. The scientists gave me a working diode and moved on to creating the next item for we engineers to make use of.
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