Apple iCloud's starts air war with Google

6/6/2011 8:16 PM EDT

Well said, Rick. I would add to your brief summary of areas where Apple and Google are clashing the media tablets. Tablets based on Android Honeycomb are emerging as the biggest challengers to iPad...

6/6/2011 10:15 PM EDT

Two important aspects that will determine the success of the "cloud" will be security of the data and availability of support. Hopefully Apple will set a standard far above the norm, which is rather awful.

I had a nightmare scenario where years worth of sent email disappeared from my Yahoo mail account. After wasting much time trying to get help from Yahoo, I basically got no support and no return of my lost email. So much for the safety of a data center. Individuals may fail to make backups of local data, but the situation is improved not a wit if cloud service providers refuse to use the backups they have.

6/7/2011 12:31 AM EDT

@PJames: Hard drive crashes suck whether they are on your drive or the one you rent space on from Yahoo. Long term products may be judged on the quality of their cloud services and cloud services may be judged on the quality of devices optimized to use them. That could give Apple another edge.

@Dylan: Can't believe I wrote a whole Apple/Google story without mentioning the iPad and Honeycomb. I must still be a bit jetlagged here in Taipei this week ;-)

6/7/2011 12:46 AM EDT

Apple mentioned $29 per year for iCloud. How much space do one get for this amount? If larger amount of cloud space is required, how much does it cost?

Also, if device is Apple, can he avail other Cloud services or is one locked to Apple iCloud only?

6/7/2011 2:53 AM EDT

Cloud storage shall offer backup service. Nonetheless, the infrastructure shall support fail-over which will effectively provide backup.

Going back to iCloud, it supports storage of your music through iTune. As far as I know, iTune won't upload all your music file to the cloud; instead, it will send the tag to iCloud. Then, Apple simply build a link between tags and the original music files. In addition, if you buy music through iTune, the music file will automatically be stored in iCloud. It is a very efficient way to provide cloud base music storage.

6/7/2011 4:13 AM EDT

I am not sure if cloud is clouding the vision of all companies. They are jointly going into the dark room each claiming in the dark to be the first in God-knows-what! Cloud computing is about computing and not about 'storage', per se. Rssentially it is not just a server which is 'broadcasting' the files requested by the user. User basically offloads some or all of his tasks into a 'cloud'.

6/7/2011 4:17 AM EDT

One of the key aspects/requirements in cloud computing is that the tasks/processes can be executed in any machine and that could indicate that 'Java' could be the key in cloud computing, running on Unix or Linux or Windows machine in the cloud. Each machine in the cloud should be able to spawn of such processes in different machines and collate their results 'sensibly'. There needs to be further consensus on what could be done in Cloud computing. Just blindly going into 'cloud computing' will lead the companies to nowhere.

6/7/2011 7:56 AM EDT

Making clouds available to users is not a big deal, except when it comes to communicating and sharing between and among other clouds. It's another way to ensure loyal customers for Apple and others and creates proprietary clouds for them. What happens when my Apple cloud friends want to share data with other clouds like Google's? I predict many clouds that benefit its proprietors but will do little for intertwined interdependence among disparate users. The sky will become very murky.

6/7/2011 10:42 AM EDT

@Raghuraman: Cloud computing may be desirable requirement for some applications. But for Apple with devices like iPod, iPhone and iPAD - do they really need Cloud computing for their typical task? Main requirement for these Apple devices is Cloud storage and sharing data.

6/7/2011 11:05 AM EDT

It sure is the best example of the private cloud being launched by one the esteemed company like Apple. Whether this icloud is offering the true cloud computing environment or not may be debatable but it is binding all the Apple products users all over the world. With such cloud service Apple can offer unified services across the globe at a very economical cost. It will be definitely a win-win situation for Apple and its customers

6/7/2011 11:19 AM EDT

Cloud storage is basically a commodity, as is physical storage on a local PC. It's just a spot to put stuff. The advantage of cloud storage, of course, is universal availability.

Given that it is a commodity, anyone who wants long-term, branded success in the cloud, will need some dramatic differentiation; something to set them apart from the masses. Whatever Google, HP or anyone else is doing, Apple has an advantage in the they are probably the best at that differentiation.

6/7/2011 4:25 PM EDT

I recently purchased music from some place other than iTunes for the first time in 10 years. Well, my Android phone didn't make it seemless. I had to download an Amazon App that did make it easy. Why the heck wouldn't Google have their own music service?

6/7/2011 4:36 PM EDT

The more I think about about cloud based services, the more I wonder who the target audience really is.

Based on the article, I envision a cloud service to be a net centric storage facility for all your data. While these seems like an innovative idea, I can't quite see any corporation wanting to store their intellectual property or financials in some unknown data bank. Even if it was 'allegedly' secure, you'd have to put alot of faith in the untested cloud service which I don't think many IT professionals will let happen.

Now take a look at it from the point of view of 'Joe PC'. He places items in the cloud for the sake of convenience without the need for proven security. Music, movies, photos & the odd document will be the mainstay of his cloud experience. Essentially, items that are not critically important if they are lost and/or stolen.

So who do I predict to come out on top of the cloud? Apple, of course. And not because they know what a cloud is and how to implement it, but because their users DON'T know what the cloud is and will blindly buy into it.

I just purchased a 16Gig USB device for $20 and that'll be my cloud service. It is connected to a lanyard so it can hang around my neck and always be available anywhere I go. As a bonus, it came with SecureID on it and only I know the password. This is my cloud service and I'll fiercely defend the integrity of it. And by the time I need more stoage, the price of a 32 Gig unit will probably be around $20.

I'd have to say that I like my idea of a cloud service the best, and there will be those who will claim otherwise. My advice to them ... get your head out of the clouds.

6/8/2011 1:26 AM EDT

I think we first have to come out of this 'cloud is storage' disposition. SaaS should be the way to look at 'cloud computing' and 'cloud' per se. Systems should be able to CHOOSE different services from different vendors in the cloud at different points of time. It could be like using 'book selection' service from Amazon, 'payment' service from PayPal, 'shipping' service from someone else. These services should be independent without any dependence on the predecessor or successor. As cloud computing grows, the granularity of these fine-grained services also will increase.

6/8/2011 3:57 AM EDT

Who needs this? :))) Who needs multi-core? Microprocessor companies are having their backs to the wall. So tape out dual core, 4 core, 8 core etc. Licensing for multi-cores is still an issue! Cloud computing is like multi-core, at least as of now. Software vendors will charge more saying 'our product is cloud enabled' :)) Ideal scenario for cloud computing is 'having a PC' with just monitor and keyboard AND SUPER-FAST CONNECTIVITY TO A CLOUD.

6/8/2011 2:09 PM EDT

Some relevant links that I got today
http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9217438/How_the_Apple_iCloud_compares_to_Google_s_cloud
This mentions about the 'super-fast connectivity and monitor+keyboard' paradigm that I mentioned. The other link is the set of white papers on cloud computing - http://www.computerworld.com/s/whitepapers/topic/158/Cloud+Computing/1

6/8/2011 11:39 PM EDT

More on Apple
http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/technology/it-just-works/2011/06/08/AGTxnZMH_story.html

Apple’s belief is clearly that users will not and should not care how the cloud actually works.

6/9/2011 7:40 PM EDT

As several commenters have pointed out, a cheap flash drive or portable hard drive solves the backup and file storage needs of most of us. Pay-as-you-go cloud storage just doesn't offer much of a value proposition (free cloud storage is a different story).

But what about true cloud computing? That won't likely be free. A very powerful desktop PC can be built for rather low cost and I will never need to pay a rental fee to use it. Pay-as-you-go cloud computing isn't likely to offer much of a value proposition either.

6/9/2011 8:21 PM EDT

I wish major EDA vendors like Mentor and Cadence offers cloud computing with their tools like Mentor Hyperlynx for simulation and similar tools. If I can interface my Altium AD10 schematic and layout to Mentor Hyperlynx for SI analysis of high speed designs on cloud computing, it will be very helpful.

6/10/2011 12:51 AM EDT

We are not even off the starting blocks of cloud computing! Major EDA vendors wont flock early. Security, license are some of the issues that come into mind immediately. If I were to analyse a gate-level netlist of a design from XYZ company using tool ABC. XYZ should have a licensing agreement with ABC, should need a secure network (like https?) to send their netlist across to the cloud, run the job (how many seconds or hours or days?), get the results back (in a file or display on screen?), debug if necessary etc. I can roll off stumbling blocks just with on-top-of-my-head thoughts.

6/10/2011 1:24 AM EDT

Some time back, I was informed that Cadence planned to offer high end software online (Cloud Computing?). You select modules you like and you pay as per use. You do not have to purchase licenses. You only need to register and login with them for this usage.

6/10/2011 2:36 PM EDT

Does anyone know what's going to happen when these devices start pulling data out of the cloud without asking permission? Will they only download on wifi networks, or will there be a lot of surprised cell phone customers?

6/10/2011 4:51 PM EDT

@PJames: one thing you should do (to backup your Yahoo emails) is enable POP access and use an Email client (like ThunderBird) and down load all your messages to your desktop. I religiously do this since I also use Yahoo Small Business services for a startup.

@Raghuraman: enjoyed reading your comments. You make too much sense that many marketing types don't want to hear!

I for one have not bought in to cloud storage concept for personal stuff. There are many open source tools today that can easily create and manage RAID-like directories for your NFS-enabled hard drives at home. When 2Tb of desktop drives are selling for less than $99, it doesn't make any sense to shell out $10's of dollars monthly for on-line storage. Stuff that I need to pass on to family members easily fits on my 8Gb USB drive. If you still want to access your content on your personal network drives, you can do so with remote desktops any way. The emerging HAN market tools will make it even more transparent for many users bypassing the cloud storage.

@hm: I just returned from DAC at San Diego yesterday. Yes, there was some buzz about cloud in EDA but no one talked about pricing models. In my opinion, the big EDA players are all allergic to the SaaS model and pay-per-use!

Dr. MP Divakar

6/11/2011 6:59 PM EDT

Dr. MP Divakar, thank you for the suggestion of using POP to download my yahoo mail. It is only a personal account, but I would hate to lose it.

6/13/2011 1:15 AM EDT

Cloud computing can only be used for 'data requests' by 'reading' or 'analysing' PUBLIC AND FREE DATA, 'performing simple, atomic transactions/computations on the same' and 'send the results back'. Sending/storing 'private' data into a 'public' cloud may be a non-starter. Cloud computing can be used to provide meaningful data/trends to people/companies ruminating on their future. Finally it boils to the DECISION that an individual or company takes after the 'data request'. For example, if you get data on what people in Texas aged beween 20 and 40 buy/search in music, maybe that could lead to a start-up in Austin or Dallas catering to this as their USP. Similarly, if you get data on what is the frequently searched job in California for people fresh out of college, may be that could lead to people thinking 'out of the box' and do something new (innovate?).

6/13/2011 10:22 AM EDT

Quite a number of companies these days seem to be having Internet security problems with their data. It's interesting to ponder the security issues associated with wide-scale cloud storage and cloud computing.

On the one hand, the cloud services companies should be experts at security. In the same sense that most companies don't design and maintain their own physical security systems, it may make sense to concentrate security expertise in the cloud services companies and end up with better overall security.

On the other hand, one breach of the right sort could potentially cause much greater damage upon a large number of companies. In addition to concentrating expertise, it would also be concentrating risk.

6/14/2011 9:08 PM EDT

Cloud computing or even more prosaic online storage can be very useful as long as the Internet infrastructure is up to the task of making the access painless. My biggest concern along those lines is the number of tollgates that are springing up. Unless ISPs can be convinced that they don't need to get a cut of everybody's business then all of these online services could be in trouble.

Larry M.