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tpfj
Rick, have you taken a good look at a Samsung Galaxy S phone? If you have, you ...
junko.yoshida
Frank, absolutely, you are dead on. I have heard so many times that high tech ...
Apple awarded $1.05B in Samsung patent case
Rick Merritt
8/24/2012 7:17 PM EDT
SAN JOSE, Calif. – Apple scored a significant but not complete legal victory on Friday in its landmark patent case against Korean rival Samsung, winning damages of $1.049 billion plus a verdict of willful infringement on many counts. The willfulness verdict opens the door to the judge awarding punitive damages of as much as three times the already record amount set by the jury.
Apple sought as much as $2.71 billion in damages from the jury and said it expected to gain at least $500 million if any infringement was found.
The nine-person jury here found that many Samsung phones in question violated most of Apple's two design and three utility patents. However, the jury found that Samsung's tablets do not infringe Apple's iPad design patent.
As a result, Apple is more likely to press the patents under consideration in this case in other patent lawsuits as well as in private negotiations with Android smartphone makers.
The judge in the case set a Sept. 20 hearing to determine whether to set an injunction against selling in the U.S. any of the products found to be infringing. Those products are generally a set of about 12 Samsung Galaxy S and S II handset models.
Samsung said it will appeal the decision, saying the verdict will lead to "fewer choices, less innovation and potentially higher prices."
The decision validates the strength of at least four Apple patents in the case, the exception being a design patent on the industrial design of the iPad. The jury also found that Samsung violated registered and unregistered trade dress, a reference to product "look and feel," on both the original and 3GS iPhones. The jurors did not buy Apple's argument about the look and feel of the iPad, however.
Apple did not infringe any of the five utility patents Samsung alleged, including two patents Samsung considered part of the 3G cellular standard. However, the jury found that Apple failed to show that the patents were invalid or that Samsung had broken contractual agreements or antitrust law regarding how the Korean company pursued the patents and their licensing.
Apple and Samsung both worked hard to show the other side's patents were invalid, bringing in many examples of what they claimed were prior art along with expert witnesses, including top academics. Ultimately, the jury held that all patents were valid.
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selinz
8/24/2012 7:41 PM EDT
With a net income of about 5billion/qtr for the whole company, I'm sure that this stings a bit. But the bigger question is can they continue to sell the S3 and tablet?
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rick.merritt
8/25/2012 2:11 AM EDT
The SIII was not accused in this case which OI believe was filed before that handset was announced.
The Galaxy Tab generally came away with very little so I suspect the road is clear for it, too.
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askubel
8/24/2012 7:52 PM EDT
I don't believe the SIII was on trial in this case (it wasn't available when the charges were filed).
This may change with future lawsuits, of course. For now the worst thing for Samsung is that consumers might get the idea that their phones are nothing but ripoffs. Nevermind the fact that the only patents they were found guilty of infringing are trivial UI elements; that's not easily understood by the average consumer. Simply the idea that something is a "copy" automatically conveys the idea of inferiority.
Anyways, I hope the next headline isn't "Enraged Samsung employee starts fire at 32nm fab".
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hm
8/24/2012 8:08 PM EDT
Samsung designer will have much difficult time ahead as they may not again like to infringe iPhone5 patents.
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t.alex
8/25/2012 2:08 AM EDT
Yes these designers will have as little as two hours of sleep a day again (aka abused by management)
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rick.merritt
8/25/2012 2:12 AM EDT
At this point I think it is moot.
Samsung has been able to gain some traction with larger screens and a faster move to LTE. So the Korean company is now actually leading in key areas where the iPhone 5 needs to play catch up.
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Robotics Developer
8/24/2012 9:52 PM EDT
I am surprised by the amount! I wonder what the long term effect of this will be on cellphone and smartphone designs? 33 multi-part questions, that must have been a nightmare for the jury, I hope that they got paid well..
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NewYankEE
8/24/2012 11:54 PM EDT
"I hope that they got paid well.."
Never heard of jury duty equating to being paid well (it usually a pittance)....perhaps you're confusing the jury with the expert witnesses or the lawyers.
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Comfortable
8/24/2012 10:27 PM EDT
$1B ? Hmmm... Isn't that offset by raising the price they charge Apple for their Samsung-manufactured ICs by about 5% ?
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wilber_xbox
8/27/2012 1:49 PM EDT
i am pretty sure that Apple buys Samsung chips on contract basis. Otherwise any manufacturer can increase the price based on demand.
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tpfj
8/24/2012 10:30 PM EDT
So the jury finds Samsung's essential IP valid, but Apple not infringing? So they think the standards committee has it wrong when they say it is essential to the making of a phone?
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rick.merritt
8/25/2012 2:13 AM EDT
Good point.
Just why they thought Samsung's 3G patents were valid but not infringed is an open question.
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tpfj
9/5/2012 12:15 PM EDT
Rick, have you taken a good look at a Samsung Galaxy S phone? If you have, you may notice that the rounded corners at the top have a smaller radius than the corners at the bottom. This is important for trade dress copying arguments. Did this come up at all? To my knowledge, Apple's iPhone rounded corners are the same top and bottom?
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Comfortable
8/24/2012 10:34 PM EDT
5% doesn't work. Sales for 2012 to Apple = $11B. Need to raise 10%.
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rusreb
8/24/2012 11:25 PM EDT
That or withhold or increase the costs to them of key display technology. Don't know how their flexible displays will work out or if they hold key patents to those but if they do it's conceivable Apple could soon be the only phone without a lower power/ thinner/ flexible display. That could really hurt. :(
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gatorfan
8/24/2012 11:45 PM EDT
Apple didn't reach this point to cut their throat. They are the leading Supply Chain management firm in the electronics universe. You can bet they have alternatives for their components.
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eewiz
8/25/2012 1:04 AM EDT
Exactly. Apple can easily find another supplier if samsung raises price.
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GroovyGeek
8/25/2012 3:31 AM EDT
This shows complete lack of understanding what it takes to manufacture and qualify a chip like the A5. First and foremost, leading edge capacity in the amount t that sole needs it simply does not exist unless TSMC pisses off their entire customer base or Intel pr GF signs on to be an Apple foundry. Second, the A5 is far from being particularly unique, it is basically and ARM core with some Apple elements. I would not be surprised if it uses substantial physical IP from Samsung. It would take upwards of an year for Apple to secure a second source in the quantities they need. The really interesting question is what their foundry contract with Samsung says. Because I am sure that at least some within Samsung are considering whether the cost of pulling the plug on Apple manufacturing is worth it. Given Apple's aggressiveness in the trial I suspect that they have a firm contract for supply a year out and are hard at work on a transition thereafter. The really interesting piece is that there are probably only two companies that they can go to, Intel and GF. In the past Intel has walked away from non profitable Apple business, and given that Intel wants to push their own mobile chip line I suspect that GF will end up with the business.
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eewiz
8/25/2012 4:20 AM EDT
you spelled it out correctly. It is a fundamental assumption that Apple is smart enough to get a binding supply contract from samsung on price/quantity/term before starting the process. Any comments without making that assumption is non sense.
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askubel
8/26/2012 9:39 PM EDT
Here's an interesting thought: What if Apple moves to x86 in one of the future next iterations of the iPhone?
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Frank Eory
8/27/2012 5:32 PM EDT
Maybe someday when x86 is as competitive on power as the ARM-based A5.
Meanwhile, you can bet that Apple didn't blindly and aggressively pursue this litigation without considering possible effects on A5 supply. Whether Plan B is TSMC, GF, UMC or some combination of foundries, I strongly suspect that Plan B is more fully developed than anyone realizes.
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Python
8/25/2012 2:04 AM EDT
Apple will experience as well its decline like Lance Amstrong !!!
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eewiz
8/25/2012 4:21 AM EDT
Not for another five years.
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elctrnx_lyf
8/25/2012 1:57 PM EDT
Samsung and apple has fought at many venues and the court decisions are aloso different in different times. This judgement is definitely a positive news for apple.
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mike.seiler
8/25/2012 5:03 PM EDT
Amazing how every court that apple tried this in around the world except the US was a loss for Apple. I guess this kind of result doesn't surprise me. Gotta support the home team. But clearly the jury weren't very intelligent if they found that the tab didn't infringe but then awarded damages against it. If I were Samsung I'd just skip the US market and focus on the rest of the world. Whats 350mil ppl comapred to what another 5.5 billion?
Maybe that kind of tactic would get better results when the American consumer is outraged at having to buy a Samsung product on overseas holidays.
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Steven P. Mitchell
8/27/2012 6:39 AM EDT
Hopefully, your reasoning improves by that time as well...
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markhahn
8/25/2012 5:31 PM EDT
apalling: apple deserves what it earns though its dedication to user experience, including cosmetic design. but it deserves no more. in particular, it does not deserve to stake out the whole universe of possible smartphone designs, excepting triangular and difficult-to-use ones. apple is an abusive monopolist of the worst order. I can only hope that IP reform will happen before samsung's appeals end.
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Steven P. Mitchell
8/27/2012 6:35 AM EDT
You're so right. Theft is so overrated and should be protected at all costs.
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Stanley_
8/25/2012 7:54 PM EDT
Now I'm pretty sure there will be no ipad mini having 7 inch screen. I can bet all my fortune for this.
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Luis Sanchez
8/26/2012 5:17 PM EDT
Well, the good thing is this is over and it's my impression that it was a fast process.
Now let's see what people with samsung phones think and do.
Will they opt for the iPhone instead?
And from all this... what does the industry learn? To make a big effort to not copy the top player?
Isn't this something that happens often in the industry? I mean... come on, a mobile phone is a mobile phone and there's not much form factor difference you can put in the design. Would there have been another reason behind which got these competitors in to the fight?
And isn't it funny how they are competitors in one field and vendor and client in another? Qualcomm tried to do this some years ago and couldn't. Part of the argument was that Qualcomm was competing against his clients.
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wilber_xbox
8/27/2012 1:52 PM EDT
my perception is that the people tend to buy genuine items even though they pay premiums. This case will be boon for Apple, which is already riding on iSuccess.
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Frank Eory
8/27/2012 5:36 PM EDT
"a mobile phone is a mobile phone and there's not much form factor difference you can put in the design."
Seriously? That may have been true prior to 2007, but the original iPhone changed everything. A good argument can be made that if not for the iPhone, there would be no Android phones either.
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Sheetal.Pandey
8/27/2012 7:03 AM EDT
I am not surprised. Apple was bound to win. They seem reasonable in their arguments. I guess they know the basics well.
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wilber_xbox
8/27/2012 1:55 PM EDT
What is the possibility that the jury's decision will be overruled by higher court? I do not have a good knowledge of the jury system. It sounds like 9 randomly picked people, who have no expertise in electronics or law have decided on who is guilty.
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Frank Eory
8/27/2012 5:37 PM EDT
The jury foreman was himself a patent holder.
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hot-electron
8/27/2012 3:43 PM EDT
What Apple will be doing with another billion $? I though they had too much cash on hand.
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Frank Eory
8/27/2012 6:23 PM EDT
It's amazing what a jury of 9 random people in Silicon Valley looks like. Any suggestion that this jury was somehow inadequate or ill-equipped to hear this case is, I think, not going to fly.
The foreman was a retired EE who worked for 35 years in the hard disk drive industry and has a patent of his own related to video compression.
Another juror was a mechanical engineer, another "an aspiring software engineer", yet another had worked at National Semiconductor and yet another had worked at various IT startups as a benefits administrator.
One prospective juror that Apple lawyers successfully excluded from the jury was a Google engineer who had worked on, among other things, the Android OS.
This info came from the following article:
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-08-25/apple-samsung-jury-may-have-leaned-on-engineer-patent-holder.html
I don't know the ins & outs of why different IP litigation cases are filed in different districts, except that there is often a strong preference for filing in Tyler, Texas -- where IP litigation is a local cottage industry. There you might be able to get a jury consisting of a farmer, a housewife, a truck driver and any number of people completely unrelated to and lacking knowledge of the electronics industry. I mean no offense to the good people of Tyler, I'm just pointing out that there is no significant local electronics industry there.
I don't quite understand the strategy of filing there. Do lawyers think a less technically sophisticated jury will be more easily influenced? That sword can cut both ways, and seems risky to me, whether you're the plaintiff or the defendant.
For a case like this one, I would think either side would prefer a Silicon Valley jury containing several members with experience in our industry.
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junko.yoshida
8/28/2012 10:03 AM EDT
Frank, absolutely, you are dead on. I have heard so many times that high tech companies do prefer to file IP litigation in Texas, rather than in Silicon Valley, precisely for the reason you mentioned. They want to confuse the juror and they want their results their way. (I was told)
But in this Apple vs Samsung case, my god, the jurors they assembled are amazing. I think it's a significant decision (and foresight) on the part of Apple to do this in the court in San Jose.
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