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Bruzzer
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Freelancer
re: Intel, AMD pull out of WSTS
Bruzzer   3/7/2012 7:50:55 AM
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AMD & Intel pull data? AMD losing share blowing antitrust case. Knows Intel market rigging and model for determining supply into future time. Intelís gaining share. Does not want to attract attention surpassing 81% including embedded. Last time I observed such silencing 1989. Computer Supplierís ad spend went dark in CRN. Right before Intel Inside morphed into metered price discrimination. Intel expansion toward foundry seems another reason likely urgent. Discontinuous memory innovation is a concern. Micron is a more efficient fabricator. Yet this leading memory, materials, fabrication aspect at inflection of physics goes beyond Micron. Some picked up WSTS to project Intel revenue; since 1997. SEC is investigating use of analytics. Intel supply data is used for projecting procurement of product routes for margin values into future time. So at inflection point in physics why doesnít Intel want to report data? Masking data makes Intel hard to see. Except for those who own a pair of special glasses which is the quantitative model. Not having WSTS data will not stop savvy QUANTA players on their investment in Intel analytics. Intel foundry targets a physical space others have been competing at for a long time. For Intel to leap frog on 20 years monopolization speaks poorly for industrial social values and democratic capitalism. I'm for Intel expanding their business. So long as Intel does not anoint, step on, infringe, limit, restrain, shift revenue among those who invest organically on best practices to compete there. So the big challenge is not AMD and Intel report to WSTS, but defining how to govern, regulate command, control, monitor INTEL as process saturates to new competitive potentials. Intel strategy is to push through molecular at process saturation so they own quantum on long time monopoly gaming. That can't happen. It would destroy what's meant to come naturally. Mike Bruzzone

mcgrathdylan
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Blogger
re: Intel, AMD pull out of WSTS
mcgrathdylan   3/1/2012 4:37:21 PM
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So what is to be done? If the accuracy of the WSTS date is in dispute, can it be fixed? And how can they change things up so that Intel and AMD and other companies continue to participate?

Industry follower
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Rookie
re: Intel, AMD pull out of WSTS
Industry follower   3/1/2012 8:20:55 AM
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Accuracy has also been a issue with the SIA data as a growing portion of companies were modeled especially the emerging players in Asia and the large dinosaurs in Japan. Quality and integrity in the data matters to users, not just frequency

Industry follower
User Rank
Rookie
re: Intel, AMD pull out of WSTS
Industry follower   3/1/2012 8:16:47 AM
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The reality is that the SIA organization has been on a downward spiral for a long time now. Most of the growth in number of companies is coming from the fabless and IP area which the SIA has not tracked consistently or with any meaningful granularity. For Intel, AMD, and Xilinx the move away makes sense. Why should they share their company information when the weight of their business is exposed in the SIA numbers? There is no benefit to these companies when they own a large part of their respective markets and the SIA subsidizes the information to their competition. Additionally, the categories that SIA still tracks are so archaic that it has no relevance to the structure of the market today. The analyst and financial community that have been so reliant on the numbers must now do their own research once again to add value and maintain credibility. My team moved away nearly 10 years ago from SIA and conducts our own bottoms up research on semiconductor companies. Most of the companies in the semiconductor and system universe rely on our data. It's time for a new organization to emerge that is more in tune with the dynamics of our business.

mcgrathdylan
User Rank
Blogger
re: Intel, AMD pull out of WSTS
mcgrathdylan   3/1/2012 6:54:04 AM
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For the record, the AMD spokesman was quoted by the Wall Street Journal as saying it was a resource issue. He did not put it in those terms when we contacted him.

mcgrathdylan
User Rank
Blogger
re: Intel, AMD pull out of WSTS
mcgrathdylan   3/1/2012 5:33:55 AM
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@the_floating_gate- thanks. We are aware of that story. But we are talking about completely different companies opting out of different programs. I will grant you that the reasoning for withdrawal is probably similar in both cases. But the plot thickens on industry cooperation going down the drain. Based presumably on the withdrawal of TSMC, UMC and Nanya last year, the SIA said Wednesday it is ceasing the SICAs reports all together. If you ask me, this is a real shame. http://www.eetimes.com/electronics-news/4237282/SIA-pulls-plug-on-fab-capacity-report

the_floating_ gate
User Rank
Rookie
re: Intel, AMD pull out of WSTS
the_floating_ gate   3/1/2012 4:20:24 AM
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Let's see if anyone can shed more light on this issue. (Yes, we will get to the bottom of this.) You're not up to date: Updated: foundries opt out of chip manufacturing stats (already forgotten? obviously I recommend to check your own stories) Peter Clarke 10/21/2011 1:52 PM EDT Asked why he thought the Taiwanese companies opted out of the program, McClean said it may be because TSMC and UMC represent such a huge portion of the world's foundry capacity and no longer wanted such detailed information on their manufacturing published each month. Years ago, McClean noted, the World Semiconductor Trade Statistics organization stopped breaking out programmable logic statistics, mainly because two dominant firms, Xilinx Inc. and Altera Corp., had emerged in that area and no longer wanted to make available detailed information about their sales each month. McClean speculated that TSMC and UMC may have had similar feelings about the breakout of foundry manufacturing data, though, as he noted, both companies release detailed sales information on a monthly basis.

Steve Szirom (InsideChips)
User Rank
Rookie
re: Intel, AMD pull out of WSTS
Steve Szirom (InsideChips)   3/1/2012 1:17:34 AM
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When the largest chip maker leaves an organization, it is usually a kiss of death. Maybe Intel being the main supplier in its category felt it was too visible and competitors could deduce what the company's strategy was from the WSTS numbers. Intel does not need WSTS but WSTS needs Intel.

junko.yoshida
User Rank
Blogger
re: Intel, AMD pull out of WSTS
junko.yoshida   2/29/2012 11:31:00 PM
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We all suspected that there must be something beyond "resource" issues, which AMD cited as a reason for their pulling out of WSTS. Let's see if anyone can shed more light on this issue. (Yes, we will get to the bottom of this.)

the_floating_ gate
User Rank
Rookie
re: Intel, AMD pull out of WSTS
the_floating_ gate   2/29/2012 9:25:31 PM
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Paying members including the "financial community" received the data upfront compared to "Joe SixPack". Than look at the track record of analysts in regards to projecting INTC's quarterly results over the last two years - having access to the data didn't do much good unless they were BSing which is not completely out of the question. Besides they never broke down in units and ASP for Joe SixPack - I bet you the analysts who paid $ had the data. Intel still publishes pricing as far as I understand. On one side its a loss - but on the other it provides a more leveled field. Compared to TSMC sales data the data is trailing anyway. Just check the TW data - plenty of hidden data - just like TSMC et al have to display capex in "real time".

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