Design Con 2015
Breaking News
Comments
Newest First | Oldest First | Threaded View
<<   <   Page 2 / 7   >   >>
Ron Neale
User Rank
Blogger
Re: CBRAM? ECM or EM good question
Ron Neale   10/2/2013 9:52:03 AM
NO RATINGS
PhyandEE: I was not trying to minimize the potential problems of mixing Ag and the silicon fab process but I think it should be possible to create an Ag based memory pore structure that keeps the silver isolated, in the same way as in the case of copper-silicon. However, I think the fact that silver is a fast diffuser in silicon raises a potential reliability problem at the memory cell level. The filament represents a silver concentration gradient in the a-Si so I would think there is a distinct possiblility that with the device in its on state the filament might just diffuse away in a radial direction with time-temperature, resulting in failure. If that is what you were trying to imply then I agree with you. When we see the reliability test results for representative devices (20nm) that should give us a good idea of the magnitude of the problem, "big" or otherwise.

 

PhyandEE
User Rank
Rookie
Re: CBRAM? ECM or EM good question
PhyandEE   10/2/2013 8:47:48 AM
NO RATINGS
Copper might be a different story. To solve this problem, for example, additional diffusion barriers are used. 

But in their work, they seem to use silver as the conducting bridge (filament). The silver atoms diffuse through the amorphous silicon and form the filament for switching. The problem comes. Silver atoms can diffuse through the whole silicon layer. The silicon layer can not be perfect. With the electrical field applied, with the heat generated, and with the time, it is a big problem. 

Ron Neale
User Rank
Blogger
Re: CBRAM? ECM or EM good question
Ron Neale   10/2/2013 5:26:27 AM
NO RATINGS
PHYandEE: I think you will find I made the same point in my comment to Peter Clarke that you will find in the last page of his piece above. I think the fact that silver is a fast diffuser in silicon and needs very little encouragement (electric field, current, heat) to move is the very reason the Crossbar device "works".

However, remember there was a time, for similar resons, when if you suggested that you wanted to use copper as a conductor on silicon people would have advised you it was not a wise step, they might have used stronger language, now its use is common.

 

PhyandEE
User Rank
Rookie
Re: CBRAM? ECM or EM good question
PhyandEE   10/1/2013 11:50:12 PM
NO RATINGS
I don't quite understand why they use Ag in a circuit. Silver is known for its serous migration effects under an electrical field. The heat by current makes this even worse. I don't know how they solve the reliablity issue using such a material.

Ron Neale
User Rank
Blogger
Re: CBRAM? ECM or EM good question
Ron Neale   10/1/2013 2:59:10 PM
NO RATINGS
Resistion-I went back and had a look at K-H Kim's thesis. It states "..movement of Ag ions in the a-Si matrix..." Suggesting a belief that those were ions moving towards the cathode, with a positive charge. Belief because there was not much evidence provided to prove the point; perhaps I missed it. It is not clear to me what elements provide for the oxidation-reduction prcess to form a ECM cell and provide the positive charged ions that you suggested need to be neutralized. Describe that for me with the elements available and you can have your positively charged Ag ion.

The thesis also states ".. Current can only flow through the device with a positve bias.." By that I think it is the current for programming to the low resistance state making the Ag electrode positive. The reason for that is because of the non-linear element that is somewhere in structure.  Current does flow in the reverse direction for erase.

resistion
User Rank
CEO
Re: CBRAM? ECM or EM good question
resistion   9/30/2013 1:00:58 PM
NO RATINGS
So it's neutral Ag that's moving?

Ron Neale
User Rank
Blogger
Re: CBRAM? ECM or EM good question
Ron Neale   9/30/2013 9:13:43 AM
NO RATINGS
Resistion-Not so much a complication, for me more a process of elimination of all possibilities. I tried to look at all the possible ways in which an electrochemical cell might be formed from the elements available in the Crossbar memory structure.

resistion
User Rank
CEO
Re: CBRAM? ECM or EM good question
resistion   9/29/2013 9:00:24 PM
NO RATINGS
I see, so the presence of mobile hydrogen could be an electrochemical complication.

Ron Neale
User Rank
Blogger
Re: CBRAM? ECM or EM good question
Ron Neale   9/29/2013 2:03:30 PM
NO RATINGS
Resistion- Hydrogen should be the only other element that is available in a-Si and would have the possiblity of being mobile. (Remember a-Si is a sub hydride of silicon). I am not sure  if it possible to make a silver-hydrogen ECM cell where oxidation-reduction takes place in the OIL RIG* sense. I did look at the possibilty that the movement of Ag into the a-Si lattice would displace hydrogen into the void at the depleted surface of the Ag electrode. I would think that would most likely trigger the crystalization of the a-Si and that would not be reversible.

For an Ag-aSi-xtalSi  Crossbar memory structure I also looked at the possibility that solid state epitaxy on the single crystal surface might account for the diode/non-linear element (or even be a way of creating one). In the the distant past I did use palladium as a catalyst for low temperature solid state epitaxy of a-Si on xtal crystal after switching for use as a PROM. Some of the details are in my US patent No 4,174,521.

Sorry *OIL-RIG Oxidation Is Loss-Reduction Is Gain, of electrons

resistion
User Rank
CEO
Re: CBRAM? ECM or EM good question
resistion   9/29/2013 9:34:19 AM
NO RATINGS
Thanks I would be interested. Earlier I meant the Ag+ ions might be neutralized in silicon instead of at the electrode. But the other effects you mentioned also could play a role.

<<   <   Page 2 / 7   >   >>


Top Comments of the Week
Flash Poll
Like Us on Facebook

Datasheets.com Parts Search

185 million searchable parts
(please enter a part number or hit search to begin)
EE Life
Frankenstein's Fix, Teardowns, Sideshows, Design Contests, Reader Content & More
<b><a href=Betajet">

The Circle – The Future's Imperfect in the Present Tense
Betajet
Post a comment
The Circle, a satirical, dystopian novel published in 2013 by San Francisco-based writer Dave Eggers, is about a large, very powerful technology company that combines aspects of Google, ...

Max Maxfield

Recommended Reads From the Engineer's Bookshelf
Max Maxfield
2 comments
I'm not sure if I read more than most folks or not, but I do I know that I spend quite a lot of time reading. I hate to be idle, so I always have a book or two somewhere about my person -- ...

Martin Rowe

No 2014 Punkin Chunkin, What Will You Do?
Martin Rowe
2 comments
American Thanksgiving is next week, and while some people watch (American) football all day, the real competition on TV has become Punkin Chunkin. But there will be no Punkin Chunkin on TV ...

Rich Quinnell

Making the Grade in Industrial Design
Rich Quinnell
15 comments
As every developer knows, there are the paper specifications for a product design, and then there are the real requirements. The paper specs are dry, bland, and rigidly numeric, making ...

Special Video Section
The LT8640 is a 42V, 5A synchronous step-down regulator ...
The LTC2000 high-speed DAC has low noise and excellent ...
How do you protect the load and ensure output continues to ...
General-purpose DACs have applications in instrumentation, ...
Linear Technology demonstrates its latest measurement ...
10:29
Demos from Maxim Integrated at Electronica 2014 show ...
Bosch CEO Stefan Finkbeiner shows off latest combo and ...
STMicroelectronics demoed this simple gesture control ...
Keysight shows you what signals lurk in real-time at 510MHz ...
TE Connectivity's clear-plastic, full-size model car shows ...
Why culture makes Linear Tech a winner.
Recently formed Architects of Modern Power consortium ...
Specially modified Corvette C7 Stingray responds to ex Indy ...
Avago’s ACPL-K30T is the first solid-state driver qualified ...
NXP launches its line of multi-gate, multifunction, ...
Doug Bailey, VP of marketing at Power Integrations, gives a ...
See how to ease software bring-up with DesignWare IP ...
DesignWare IP Prototyping Kits enable fast software ...
This video explores the LT3086, a new member of our LDO+ ...
In today’s modern electronic systems, the need for power ...