Design Con 2015
Breaking News
Comments
Newest First | Oldest First | Threaded View
Etmax
User Rank
Rookie
Re: Ouch!
Etmax   8/13/2013 10:34:38 AM
NO RATINGS
Personally I think the long scaling law in DRAM where we needed ever more RAM for bigger applications was artificially driven by bad compilers os OS bloating. There are very few applications that need to have the large data sets that 3GB of RAM supports, the only ones I can think of are 3D modeling, CGI and a few games.

All of the rest are just because the compilers & OS are very cavalier with memory. It seems now the standard is that if one routing in a library is used the whole 100 MB of code in the library is added to the program.

If you look at the executable with a hex editor you often see MB's of text strings stored in there that have nothing to do with the applciation.

The other thing that seems to have happened is that this bloat slows a lot of programs down seemingly requiring a faster CPU too.

TanjB
User Rank
Rookie
Re: Ouch!
TanjB   8/12/2013 9:54:52 PM
NO RATINGS
Isn't part of the problem that DRAM has essentially hit the feature size wall for charge storage devices - the same wall everyone panics about Flash reaching, but DRAM reached it without fuss in the past year or two since no-one was much paying attention?  After all, who needed more DRAM?

Now we have a steady state product (well, going sideways, low power mobile, vertical stacking, etc.) and when consumption ticks up there is no slack in the system.

Etmax
User Rank
Rookie
Re: Ouch!
Etmax   8/11/2013 9:47:16 PM
NO RATINGS
?? I would have thought if the PC price went up 40% due to DRAM prices it would have an impact, but by the looks of things that will only change 1-2%, hardly worth a mention given that life's inflation rate is 2-3%. In relative terms a PC might have actually gone down in price.

bmccleanicinsights
User Rank
Rookie
Re: capacity allocation
bmccleanicinsights   8/9/2013 12:25:54 PM
NO RATINGS
Yes, the rising DRAM ASPs could have a negative effect on the PC market.  The increasing DRAM prices typically don't increase the price of the PC (the PC suppliers take lower margins) but they make it more difficult to lower the price of the PC.  Currently, many PC manufacturers are looking to lower the price of their ultrabooks to try to spur increased market acceptance and rising DRAM prices make it more difficult to do this.

There really is the "elasticity of demand" effect in the DRAM market.  History has shown that when DRAM ASPs are collapsing, unit volumes oftentimes surge.  However, when DRAM ASPs climb, DRAM unit shipments are oftentimes weak.  This is likely to hold true in 2013 as DRAM ASPs are forecast to jump 40% this year (with the DRAM market up 28%) but DRAM unit volume shipments are forecast to decline 8%.

 

 

Peter Clarke
User Rank
Blogger
Re: capacity allocation
Peter Clarke   8/9/2013 6:11:30 AM
NO RATINGS
There is also the issue that as DRAM ASPs spike they will make PCs more expensive, further inhibiting sales.

I am sure Bill McClean and IC Insights have tried to take this into account, but it could become a negative spiral for DRAM, thereby hurting the market growth.

With the potential for some overproduction of NAND flash for mobile equipment in 2H13 could some of that production get diverted to solid-state drives for PCs?

bmccleanicinsights
User Rank
Rookie
Re: capacity allocation
bmccleanicinsights   8/8/2013 4:01:58 PM
NO RATINGS
I know in the past that it was not an "easy" transition to move from producing DRAM to flash and vice versa.  Micron at one time mentioned that it took about 6 months for the transition and a little more time to achieve peak yields again.  There was also some additional investment as well.  Moreover, you are not producing product on the fab line during the transition which will have a negative impact on sales.

any1
User Rank
CEO
capacity allocation
any1   8/8/2013 2:40:51 PM
NO RATINGS
I think any price spikes in DRAM will be short lived simply because the tool set needed to make both DRAM and NAND flash is so similar Samsung, Hynix, and Micron can easily switch capacity back and forth between the two.  So as prices for NAND parts soften more capacity will be converted over to DRAM production. 

Peter Clarke
User Rank
Blogger
Re: Ouch!
Peter Clarke   8/8/2013 10:35:39 AM
NO RATINGS
What's good for the memory vendors is bad for the memory buyers.

Who remembers DRAM supplements that had to be paid with PCs...or the cases when an unscrupulous sales channel would strip DIMMs out of PCs so they could sell them separately.

That meant PCs shipped with less DRAM than advertized and the naughty sales channel reckoned that most customers would never cotton on. 

rick merritt
User Rank
Author
Ouch!
rick merritt   8/8/2013 10:30:29 AM
NO RATINGS
That's going to hurt for a lot of folks



Top Comments of the Week
Flash Poll
Like Us on Facebook

Datasheets.com Parts Search

185 million searchable parts
(please enter a part number or hit search to begin)
EE Life
Frankenstein's Fix, Teardowns, Sideshows, Design Contests, Reader Content & More
<b><a href=Betajet">

The Circle – The Future's Imperfect in the Present Tense
Betajet
1 Comment
The Circle, a satirical, dystopian novel published in 2013 by San Francisco-based writer Dave Eggers, is about a large, very powerful technology company that combines aspects of Google, ...

Max Maxfield

Recommended Reads From the Engineer's Bookshelf
Max Maxfield
6 comments
I'm not sure if I read more than most folks or not, but I do I know that I spend quite a lot of time reading. I hate to be idle, so I always have a book or two somewhere about my person -- ...

Martin Rowe

No 2014 Punkin Chunkin, What Will You Do?
Martin Rowe
2 comments
American Thanksgiving is next week, and while some people watch (American) football all day, the real competition on TV has become Punkin Chunkin. But there will be no Punkin Chunkin on TV ...

Rich Quinnell

Making the Grade in Industrial Design
Rich Quinnell
16 comments
As every developer knows, there are the paper specifications for a product design, and then there are the real requirements. The paper specs are dry, bland, and rigidly numeric, making ...

Special Video Section
The LT8640 is a 42V, 5A synchronous step-down regulator ...
The LTC2000 high-speed DAC has low noise and excellent ...
How do you protect the load and ensure output continues to ...
General-purpose DACs have applications in instrumentation, ...
Linear Technology demonstrates its latest measurement ...
10:29
Demos from Maxim Integrated at Electronica 2014 show ...
Bosch CEO Stefan Finkbeiner shows off latest combo and ...
STMicroelectronics demoed this simple gesture control ...
Keysight shows you what signals lurk in real-time at 510MHz ...
TE Connectivity's clear-plastic, full-size model car shows ...
Why culture makes Linear Tech a winner.
Recently formed Architects of Modern Power consortium ...
Specially modified Corvette C7 Stingray responds to ex Indy ...
Avago’s ACPL-K30T is the first solid-state driver qualified ...
NXP launches its line of multi-gate, multifunction, ...
Doug Bailey, VP of marketing at Power Integrations, gives a ...
See how to ease software bring-up with DesignWare IP ...
DesignWare IP Prototyping Kits enable fast software ...
This video explores the LT3086, a new member of our LDO+ ...
In today’s modern electronic systems, the need for power ...