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rick merritt
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Must be 32 bit
rick merritt   9/10/2013 5:08:02 PM
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Chatting with fave analysts Kevin Krewell and David Kanter in the IDF media room I realize Quark must be 32 bit. There's just no need for 64-bit addressing in IoT for a loooooong time.

CharlieCL
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Re: Must be 32 bit
CharlieCL   9/11/2013 12:59:32 PM
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Quark is 32-bit Pentium based ISA with single Core, single Thread.

rick merritt
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Re: Must be 32 bit
rick merritt   9/11/2013 5:45:16 PM
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@CharlieCL: What's your source on this?

markhahn0
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Re: Must be 32 bit
markhahn0   9/11/2013 11:41:12 PM
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I don't know anything, except that AMD64 introduced a lot more than just a bigger address space.  IA32 is really not a good/modern ISA, and it would be quite strange to see Intel falling back 10+ years.  one real register, stack-based x87, no vectorization, etc.  at the time, 64b extensions were justified as not adding a lot of chip complexity - of course that's relative to OoO/superscalar stuff.

alex_m1
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Is it really more secure?
alex_m1   9/11/2013 5:10:20 AM
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At least according to a few software engineers I asked about this subject, symantec and wind river doesn't offer something unique security-related. It's mostly branding. I wonder if this is the only benefit for this chip, or are there others planned?

sw guy
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Re: Is it really more secure?
sw guy   9/11/2013 6:43:58 AM
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Of course you can be secure with other CPU, too. As an example, why is ARM used inside chip+PIN card reader ?

I do not want to say using Quark was a bad decision, just that public justification may differ from actual one.

alex_m1
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Re: Must be 32 bit
alex_m1   9/11/2013 10:38:07 AM
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GSMD , very interesting post.


Could you please tell a bit about where mcaffee security is relative to to other software stacks?

Kinnar
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Benefit of Being since long in Computing environment
Kinnar   9/11/2013 12:02:18 PM
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Getting better opportunities on the security and embedded internet stack because of very long stay in the computing environment will be a very good plus point for Intel on getting proven in IoT Processor segment.

rick merritt
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Re: Must be 32 bit
rick merritt   9/11/2013 5:44:33 PM
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@GSMD: Thanks for weighing in!

Question: Doesn't the x86 support the same hardware root of trust the Trusted Computing Group nspecified and ARM Trustzone implmewnts in its own way?

 

HardwIntr
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an answer in last year's IDF ?
HardwIntr   9/12/2013 4:18:37 AM
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http://www.anandtech.com/show/5555/intel-at-isscc-12-more-research-into-near-threshold-voltage

Aeroengineer
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Curious about Potential Packages
Aeroengineer   9/12/2013 7:28:18 AM
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I am particularly curious to see what packaging options this device will come in.  I am wondering if this product is aimed at the Cortex M market, or the lower end of the Cortex A series?  If it is aimed at the M, say M4F with a higher clock speed, it would be interesting to see this type of device in a QFN and QFP.  If it is competing with the A series, I expect that this will only be available as a BGA.

rick merritt
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Re: Curious about Potential Packages
rick merritt   9/12/2013 12:33:38 PM
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@Aero: Great questions!

Anyone have any answers for that yet?

I have heard varius speculations Intel is targeting 386, 486 or Pentium performance. We are all still wating for details from Intel.

Aeroengineer
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Re: Curious about Potential Packages
Aeroengineer   9/12/2013 3:23:34 PM
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I will be very much interested to hear this.  Some of the Cortex M devices are reaching this level of performance.  If Intel comes down this far, and QFN/QFP packages are available, I could see this being a possible device that a hobbiest could use.  I will be very interested to see more about this device.

Sanjib.A
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Re: Curious about Potential Packages
Sanjib.A   9/12/2013 10:56:31 PM
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Happy to hear that this tiny chip could give 486, Pentium kind of performance, that would be great!! Will this be somewhere close to the SoC launched by AMD recently: G-series SoC? Probably having lower performance and features than that?

The part that scares me is "...suggesting it is more of a rushed trial balloon than a nailed-down product and strategy.

I would dare not think about using it if there are no clear strategy and a clear road-map. Any tentative timeline announced for its release?

elctrnx_lyf
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Re: Curious about Potential Packages
elctrnx_lyf   9/14/2013 3:19:59 PM
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Intel is definitely doing a lot more than what we could actually imagine. So there is still much more to Intel.

rick merritt
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Lessons learned?
rick merritt   9/12/2013 12:36:45 PM
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Intel had an initative to provide a syntesizeable Atom core at TSMC that quietly went away. I wonder what they learned that could be applied to this effort?

alex_m1
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Re: Lessons learned?
alex_m1   9/12/2013 1:02:30 PM
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Maybe they learned that on it's own, x86 core doesn't sell for this market, at least well enough to justify a chip production and the risks invoved.

This could be the reason behind buying wind river and mcaffee.

victortagayun
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Raspi
victortagayun   9/13/2013 3:01:47 AM
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Will it have the pricepoint and performance of raspi? Or is it of different league?

rick merritt
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Re: Raspi
rick merritt   9/13/2013 3:54:52 PM
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@Victor: Excellent question. The consensus here is it will be a 486/Pentium class CPU, but Intel is not saying yet.

LarryM99
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Re: Raspi
LarryM99   9/16/2013 6:11:45 PM
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It seems to me that it would make sense to strip off legacy support in a product like this. Why carry along MS-DOS compatability and segmented memory models when they are competing with ARMs that have a much cleaner architecture? The x86 has been overdue for cleaning out the attic for quite a while. Does anyone know if that is what they are doing here?

jaybus0
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Re: Raspi
jaybus0   9/18/2013 7:10:05 AM
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I suspect it is one of the P54C-like cores designed for the Single-chip Cloud Computer project or something very similar. 

sw guy
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Re: Raspi
sw guy   9/18/2013 7:58:49 AM
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Remember the 80376 processor ?

jaybus0
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Re: Raspi
jaybus0   9/20/2013 8:40:53 AM
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The 80376 was replaced by the 80386EX, which still kept the static core capable uf running at low clock speeds all the way down to halt to save power. But it also kept the 26-bit addressing, so wouldn't be appropriate for re-implementing at a smaller process size without a major update. But I do think it is probably a shrunken older core. I chose the P54C because it has already been worked on for the Single-chip Cloud Computer project and Larrabee.

LennyP
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Re: Must be 32 bit
LennyP   9/21/2013 10:06:57 PM
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Considering the only requirements we know from the article was "to offer a remote maintenance capability with high security." it's rather far fetched to claim a "poor technical decision" as you maintain.  There are lots of reasons, besides the level of security provided, which would come into play in the decision by Daikin; think ease of use, maintainability, support, etc.

 Using your reference design for a tablet with military grade security is not revalent as this is not a tablet, not needing to meet military anything, and only "high security."


And, no, I'm not associated with Intel, Freescale, ARM, or anyone else; I'm a retired engineer with well over thirty years experience designing embedded systems. 

 



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