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Re: Deterministic Unified Ethernet Backbone
junko.yoshida   9/20/2013 9:11:46 PM
Thanks for posting the additional information, and pointing us to the right linked-in group. Much appreciated!

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Deterministic Unified Ethernet Backbone
DetereministicUnifiedEth   9/20/2013 9:04:28 PM
Ethernet with right services can support design of highly integrated systems and generic architectures, supporting hard RT, RT and soft-time functions.
It is about Ethernet as an synchronous/asynchronous backbone (i.e. deterministic unified Ethernet) using completely open standards, integrated on an Ethernet switch chip.

Critical functions cannot be affected by traffic flooding, and their communication is absolutely congestion-free.
You can compare it to FlexRay-like behavior in an Ethernet network, but @ Ethernet aggregate bandwidth (100MBit/s or higher).
The Ethernet bandwidth not used for vehicle-critical functions can be used for all other diagnose and multimedia functions (or something else).

You are right about - Real world experience brings confidence,
In integrated systems there is another important reason why the determinism of communication is required.
You want to virtualize a generic embedded system so that critical and non-critical functions share common resources (IO, CPU, ..,) and execute smoothly without interferences.
It is a different challenge in comparison to design of simple distributed controls, and cannot be done easily just by statistical multiplexing and overprovisioning.

And finally if you get absolute guarantees for deterministic communication for free at zero effort, why spending many Person-Years (PYs)  to get it right on your own for every new project?

Join "Deterministic Ethernet Group" @ LinkedIn  to learn more about what is Ethernet, what it can be, and what is required to build advanced integrated systems with Ethernet.

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prabhakar_deosthali   9/20/2013 8:15:23 AM
I agree with @Bert22306. Most of the features which go into the design considerations regarding the speed, the redundancy, the error correction methodologies and so on are underutlised  in the final products or may not even get implemented in the products.


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Re: Experience brings confidence
Kinnar   9/19/2013 7:21:08 AM
It is very interesting design, how synchronous traffic will be a part of Ethernet switch, Ethernet networks being packet switched networks. 

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Re: Competition for Broadcom
junko.yoshida   9/18/2013 4:08:34 PM
@Rick, I wouldn't describe as such that NXP is taking a different route. NXP is one of the early supporters of Open Alliance Sig (http://www.opensig.org/), originally started by Broadcom, and NXP's solution is compliant to BroadR-Reach spec. It's just that NXP is getting help from TTTech, a developer of Ethernet IPs, for this particular automotive Ethernet IP. 

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Experience brings confidence
Bert22306   9/18/2013 3:37:15 PM
My observation in this field is that initially, many people have a gut reaction that you "must have determinism," for control system message traffic. So they insist on adding bells and whistles to supposedly achieve this determinism, even though the mechanisms may not work as they imagined. An example of this might be the old FDDI "synchronous mode," which ultimately did not guarantee anything from the actual client system's point of view, and I doubt it was ever put to effective use.

Real world experience brings confidence, however. You design the control algorithms intelligently, adequately over-provision the network, test it out, and eventually forget about those early obsessions about "determinism."

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Re: Competition for Broadcom
Sanjib.A   9/18/2013 1:51:15 PM
As I understand FlexRay has its own advantages over Ethernet to have its place in automotive functional applications excepts its speed not more than 10Mbits/s. If we talk about connecting in-car "info media" devices using a Ethernet backbone, Ethernet makes sense because of the speed, For connecting automotive control devices Ethernet needs to have some extension which would be certified per ISO26262, isn't it? Also security is another aspect when everything will eventually get connected to outside world.


rick merritt
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Competition for Broadcom
rick merritt   9/18/2013 12:19:00 PM
Broadcom has been driving an initiative here as its entry into automotive, leveraging its deep Ethernet expertise.

NXP seems to be taking a different route leveraging automotive expertise and bringing in thrd-party Ethernet.

Meanwhile standards are moving along:
2013-06-03Ethernet preps for real-time role in cars, factories

As data rates begin to move beyond 25 Gbps channels, new problems arise. Getting to 50 Gbps channels might not be possible with the traditional NRZ (2-level) signaling. PAM4 lets data rates double with only a small increase in channel bandwidth by sending two bits per symbol. But, it brings new measurement and analysis problems. Signal integrity sage Ransom Stephens will explain how PAM4 differs from NRZ and what to expect in design, measurement, and signal analysis.

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