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zewde yeraswork
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Blogger
Re: Sell vs. let it wither
zewde yeraswork   2/10/2014 11:43:46 AM
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how so? what kind of entitiies exist there instead of corporations? Of course, the corporate dominance felt in the United States isn't as strong in places like Europe....

HardwIntr
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Freelancer
Re: Sell vs. let it wither
HardwIntr   2/10/2014 11:21:20 AM
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"Germany is not yet fully taken by corporatiions"   EXACTLY  , nor banks and government crooks.

 

Thinking of it today, i was asking myself were the future STEM students, you know, those the US desperately need, will work if IBM and all  outsource their fabs.  Perhaps they just need Powerpoint end Spreadsheet experts just to impress shareholders. They should tell them now not to loose their time.

Ratgebber
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Freelancer
Re: Sell vs. let it wither
Ratgebber   2/10/2014 9:12:23 AM
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Germany is not yet fully taken by corporatiions

KVRR
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Apprentice
Another IBM Facility
KVRR   2/10/2014 9:06:16 AM
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I guess most of us are overlooking IBM's partnership/presence in Albany, NY (CNSE/university), where it has sizeable R&D going on, which can act as R&D facility for them in case they put their fabs for sale.

vlsi_guy
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Manager
Re: Sell vs. let it wither
vlsi_guy   2/10/2014 9:04:51 AM
GDP is not the only metric I would look at for a healthy society & economy (i.e., service sector contributions). Let's say I was Ireland in the mid 1800's. And we were so proud of having 100% of our locally grown produce being the wonderful potatoe! Then, 1845 hits... Get the picture, health is moderation in everything, or like in nature, a multitude of diversity.

Unlimited growth in one type of entity (e.g., service sector), well, I would use the analogy of a cancer is more appropriate.

 

From the website "Facts about Germany":

It is not only the 30 major corporations such as Siemens, Volkswagen, Allianz, SAP and BASF listed on the German share index (DAX) that make the country competitive internationally, but ten thousands of small and medium-sized enterprises (up to 500 employees) in manufacturing, in particular mechanical engineering, the supplier industry, as well as nano and biotechnology, which frequently form clusters. Small and medium-sized enterprises employ over 25 million people, making them the biggest employer. They are regarded as the backbone of the German economy and also provide the majority of apprenticeships for young people. Industry is also an important pillar of the German economy. In comparison with other industrial nations such as Great Britain and the USA it has a broad basis with a strong workforce – five million people work in industrial companies. In no other traditional economy does classic indus-trial production play a comparably major role. It contributes some percent to German economic output.

 

HardwIntr
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Freelancer
Re: Sell vs. let it wither
HardwIntr   2/10/2014 6:27:21 AM
Germany didn't outsource their manufacturing to Far east or whatever low cost labor countries, or if they do it's in neighbor countries; they don't need mass immigration except for high skilled workers and mostly from other European countries. Other countries just do the exact contrary. Guess where the problems are.

Ratgebber
User Rank
Freelancer
Re: Sell vs. let it wither
Ratgebber   2/9/2014 12:46:31 PM


The service sector contributes around 70% of the total GDP (http://www.princeton.edu/~achaney/tmve/wiki100k/docs/Economy_of_Germany.html)

 

vlsi_guy
User Rank
Manager
Re: Sell vs. let it wither
vlsi_guy   2/9/2014 12:29:12 PM
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Every mature economy? What about Germany, they buck the trend and don't seem to be hurting? 

Also, see the article ... 

Business for Engineers: Offshore Outsourcing

 

groach
User Rank
Rookie
Re: Yes to GloFo
groach   2/9/2014 11:49:29 AM
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Is the yellow flag you speak of by any chance GF itself since it is ownded by ATIC, an investment company owned by Mubadala Development Company, a wholly owned investment company of the Government of Abu Dhabi in the United Arab Emirates.


 Apple does not make chips but has Asia build them.  GF is the old AMD foundary division bought by the Middle East.  So buying GF built Si you are putting money into the Middle East.  Intel has about 80K US employees and over 100K worldwide.  I love all the smack that people say about Intel, yet it is the only big player in the fab world that is a US company building in the US.  There are fabs in Ireland and Isreal.  Other than an old technology China fab, all new and state of the art chips are built in the US by Americans. 

 

So for those that want to see Intel go bust someday, an Intel crash will make the GM debacle look like good days.  GF is controlled by the Middle East, TSMC and Samsung are Asia.  The dominent US chip manufacture is Intel.  Who do you really want to do well and why???   

 As for IBM selling off, the government has at times stepped in to stop the transfer of technology to flagged buyers.  AMD sold off their fabs, but one problem they have had is buy selling off their fabs, they have less ability to develop their owpn Si technology.  If price was right, doesn't it help to have R&D to help further your chip designs?  If AMD wanted to  join an investment group for the future.  They sold off fabs to GF.  Gaining access to the art R&D might help position them to push their products moving forward.  Who to partner with?  Hard to say what group would come together with enough money.  In the end its all speculation for IBM's buyer. 

 Google has the money - and they're trying to branch into robotics - how about them expanding into chip design? (just a random thought).

 

Ratgebber
User Rank
Freelancer
Re: Sell vs. let it wither
Ratgebber   2/9/2014 11:15:05 AM
NO RATINGS
Every mature economy moves to services and more so under rampant capitalism. However, recalling Feynman's words: "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled."

 

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