Breaking News
Comments
Newest First | Oldest First | Threaded View
daleste
User Rank
Author
Re: Cost/transistor figures
daleste   3/25/2014 8:22:51 PM
NO RATINGS
The other issue is, as you shrink to new technology nodes and grow the wafer size, the number of die per wafer you get may be more than you can sell.  Even if you only run 12 wafers per lot, which is not as economical as running full lots, you may get too many dice for your demand, unless you have a very large die size.  This is why it has been more economical for Intel to move to these cutting edge technologies quicker than the rest of the industry since the processor die sizes tend to be larger than the products from the rest of the industry.

alex_m1
User Rank
Author
Re: 180nm followed by 65nm
alex_m1   3/25/2014 5:11:44 PM
NO RATINGS
I think de geus is measuring "large" by number of designs/number of tool licenses. Considering 180nm is the most popular node for mcu's and probably for analog which have plenty of small designs(just look at the vareity of mcu's).

alex_m1
User Rank
Author
Re: Cost/transistor figures
alex_m1   3/25/2014 5:09:18 PM
NO RATINGS
Yes double/triple litho costs more, but they only do it for a very few layers(out of something like maybe 15-20) and litho is only 25% of total costs according to you're article. How does it become so expensive part of total cost?

rick merritt
User Rank
Author
Re: 180nm followed by 65nm
rick merritt   3/25/2014 4:42:16 PM
NO RATINGS
@Wilbur: De Geuss said 90nm was never that big because of delays getting it up and running. Not sure why 180nm has been so large but it is in the middle of the field of process nodes still in use today.

rick merritt
User Rank
Author
Re: Cost/transistor figures
rick merritt   3/25/2014 4:40:59 PM
NO RATINGS
@Alex: The main reason for higher costs is the need to pattern some layers of 20nm and later chips two or more times under immersion litho machines to get the needed resolution.

alex_m1
User Rank
Author
Re: Cost/transistor figures
alex_m1   3/25/2014 4:34:53 PM
NO RATINGS
Rick ,


Is it possible that one big reason behind those high prices is the lack of competition at advanced nodes ?

wilber_xbox
User Rank
Author
180nm followed by 65nm
wilber_xbox   3/25/2014 12:37:13 PM
NO RATINGS
Rick, do you know what is still driving 180nm technology. Are there additional benefits/cost related advantages. Also what about 130nm or 90nm? I think 90nm should have been better poised than 65nm.

wilber_xbox
User Rank
Author
Re: Cost/transistor figures
wilber_xbox   3/25/2014 12:33:39 PM
NO RATINGS
The marignal decrease in cost below 28nm is mostly due to double/triple patterning of the mask and the additional complexity in patterning. Going to 450mm wafer is major undertaking and given today's semi environment no company wants to risk money. I think it puts additional pressure on ASML to deliver EUV.

daleste
User Rank
Author
Re: Cost/transistor figures
daleste   3/24/2014 9:53:27 PM
NO RATINGS
I don't have any data for costs at 16/14nm, but I'm not surprised that the demise of Moore's law is again being brought up.  New process nodes are very expensive both in equipment and engineering to get it yielding.  Sometimes it is hard to see any reduction of cost for a long time.  Going to a larger diameter wafer is even more expensive since almost all of the fab equipment has to be replaced to handle the larger wafer.  Again, it takes a lot of engineering effort and time to get the yields up.

rick merritt
User Rank
Author
Cost/transistor figures
rick merritt   3/24/2014 8:18:31 PM
NO RATINGS
Anybody have data on cost/transistor at 16/14nm?



Datasheets.com Parts Search

185 million searchable parts
(please enter a part number or hit search to begin)
Radio
NEXT UPCOMING BROADCAST

What are the engineering and design challenges in creating successful IoT devices? These devices are usually small, resource-constrained electronics designed to sense, collect, send, and/or interpret data. Some of the devices need to be smart enough to act upon data in real time, 24/7. Are the design challenges the same as with embedded systems, but with a little developer- and IT-skills added in? What do engineers need to know? Rick Merritt talks with two experts about the tools and best options for designing IoT devices in 2016. Specifically the guests will discuss sensors, security, and lessons from IoT deployments.
Like Us on Facebook
Special Video Section
LED lighting is an important feature in today’s and future ...
05:27
The LT8602 has two high voltage buck regulators with an ...
05:18
The quality and reliability of Mill-Max's two-piece ...
01:34
Why the multicopter? It has every thing in it. 58 of ...
Security is important in all parts of the IoT chain, ...
Infineon explains their philosophy and why the multicopter ...
The LTC4282 Hot SwapTM controller allows a board to be ...
This video highlights the Zynq® UltraScale+™ MPSoC, and sho...
Homeowners may soon be able to store the energy generated ...
The LTC®6363 is a low power, low noise, fully differential ...
See the Virtex® UltraScale+™ FPGA with 32.75G backplane ...
Vincent Ching, applications engineer at Avago Technologies, ...
The LT®6375 is a unity-gain difference amplifier which ...
The LTC®4015 is a complete synchronous buck controller/ ...
10:35
The LTC®2983 measures a wide variety of temperature sensors ...
The LTC®3886 is a dual PolyPhase DC/DC synchronous ...
The LTC®2348-18 is an 18-bit, low noise 8-channel ...
The LT®3042 is a high performance low dropout linear ...
Chwan-Jye Foo (C.J Foo), product marketing manager for ...