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LisaBrown
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discrimination is illegal
LisaBrown   2/28/2015 5:26:54 AM
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Indeed, if there are two equal candidates, discrimination is illegal. We'll have to disagree on whether the candidates were equal on the evidence provided. People at the same level should be treated equally. This means we should get rid of affirmative action based on irrelevant factors and judge people on relevant merit alone. The gender of a manager should make no difference if the manager is doing good management. Lisa, manager from VitaLoans

Susan Rambo
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Re: Delusions
Susan Rambo   3/31/2014 5:57:18 PM
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Smart move, perl_geek, very smart. 

perl_geek
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Delusions
perl_geek   3/31/2014 1:31:57 PM
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Why do hiring managers persist in the illusion that they are offering a "long-term career". Even if the firm is still in existence in 5 years' time, what is the likelihood that they won't have downsized, outsourced, or otherwise shed the marks they are trying to lure into their employment?

If I was in a position to hire, I would look for "non-traditional" candidates. If they've chosen to buck a stereotype, they're probably enthusiatic and better than average. There's also likely to be much less competition (from the blinkered bigots) to hire and keep them.

prabhakar_deosthali
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re:
prabhakar_deosthali   3/31/2014 11:11:22 AM
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One of the reasons why hiring managers prefer Men over Women could be that the hiring managers have a feeling that very few of the women employees have a long term career goal and may not stay long with the company , that hires them.

 

This is actually not true as now most of the women employees have long term career aspirations and would like to keep their career in tact even after the marriage and kids if they supportive husbands .

sripriya_nano
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Re: No wonder
sripriya_nano   3/31/2014 2:54:29 AM
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Is there anything that can be done, as a female STEM job candidate to actively counteract this bias? Is it a case of the benefit of doubt not being extended in the same way to female candidates, or is it a case of communication styles differing? 

Susan Rambo
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Re: I remain skeptical
Susan Rambo   3/30/2014 6:03:59 PM
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Thanks for the movie recommendation, Bert. It looks like a good one. I'll have to check it out. (Good actors in it, too). Yes, society is "us." I think government is us, too, at least that's the concept in a democracy.

Bert22306
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Re: I remain skeptical
Bert22306   3/30/2014 5:37:10 PM
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Exactly, Susan. And as a matter of fact, "society" is us. People make the changes, not some amorphous faceless concept that we can conveniently blame.

I especially liked that quote about "not giving a crap," because of course, that applies to ANYONE in STEM fields. You don't succeed by spending your time in school trying to be the most popular jock in the class, right?

I really liked the movie October Sky. It shows kids who had the courage of their convictions.

Susan Rambo
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Re: I remain skeptical
Susan Rambo   3/30/2014 4:52:22 PM
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Thanks, Bert for that article link. That  New York Times article, mentioned in the beginning of your article is really interesting. If you read to the bottom of the article, the author interviews some women who do have PhDs in science and who are successful in their fields; she asks them how they made it so far. The women said:

--------

"Oh, that's easy," one of them said. "We're the women who don't give a crap."

Don't give a crap about — ?

"What people expect us to do."

"Or not do."

"Or about men not taking you seriously because you dress like a girl. I figure if you're not going to take my science seriously because of how I look, that's your problem."

"Face it," one of the women said, "grad school is a hazing for anyone, male or female. But if there are enough women in your class, you can help each other get through."

--------

I like that attitude and think that may be the key. Don't wait for society to change if you want to do science. Step up and do it.

wilber_xbox
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Re: study shows
wilber_xbox   3/30/2014 12:54:24 AM
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The study has its limitations. For example there are fields other then STEM such as Medicine, Hospitality, Care etc where women are preferred to Men. 

freddgomez
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study shows
freddgomez   3/29/2014 9:34:04 PM
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This does not apply to all countries, and does not infer to the whole population of Mother Earth.

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