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Great sharing an augmented moment with everyone. 

Blogger

@Max Thank you for inviting and organizing this chat! It was very interesting for me!

Rookie

@Dr Thomas: I didn't hear, but will have a look today.

@Rick Merritt: talking about image and marker based AR I would say there should be improvement in stability, as often information overlay gets disturbed due to glare, too big distance, etc. But in perspective SLAM or something even more progressive will lead the way.

 

Rookie

Thanks everyone!

Manager

Thank you everyone, and thank you Max! @Rick, pleasure discussing AR with you as well. 

Servus! And hope to see some of you at AWE next week. 

Thanks Max and everyone. I learned a lot today.

Rookie

@Rick - Wiesnbier, and yes. Delicious. But Generally can be trouble for non-Germans, as the constant live-band classic rock, dirndls and general mirth make you forget you're drinking beer that has about twice the alcohol content. 

I'm really sorry everyone -- I have to go -- I have a conference call starting up in 1 minute -- but I think we need to keep thsi AR talk going in the future because I honestly believe AR is going to be the biggest thing out there in the not so distant future

@Thomas Alt: I learned to love wiesenbier (sp?) in Giessen before it became popular in the US.

 

Author

@Duane- thanks, you too!

@controlfreak- we've been working with a single hospital for about 3 years now on that very project. It's under constant development, and the solution you want is very difficult in real-world application, especially with altitude. Add in compliance regulations and it's a very long-term thing. 

@Rick Merritt - Is AR an app for the broader tech of embedded vision?

Embedded vision is a promoting technology for AR.

Manager

@Sheepdoll - I am a local! That's all I can order!

In addition to the store mapping concept, couldn't the same technology be used for navigating in hospitals? I can't tell you how many times I have gone to the information desk and they told me to go up to the third floor, make a right , go down the hall, turn left at the fire extinguisher and the lab will be at the end of the hall next to the radiology department. I frequently get lost. Maybe this would be an application where they wouldn't be trying to upsell you something?

Rookie

I've got to depart. Good chatting with you all.

Blogger

@Max - it's all about the Tegenseer Helles, and the Augustiner Oktoberfest Bier :) 

Cedit - oh so great -- they sell lists of every fucking thing you buy to competitors goons - so the goons can use it to stop the project you are working on in some lines of work

Manager

@DariaG: What should I watch for in tracking technology? A new milestone in resolution? speed?

Author

@Dr Alt -  When on tour in Swizerland and Germany we would be given a lunch allowance for a top price meal.  I would find a place that had beer, bread and sausage for about 1/4 the price and pocket the rest of the allowance.   Always order the "local" Beer.

Blogger

@Rick: Is AR an app for the broader tech of embedded vision?


Yes- embedded vision is just camera and camera sensors that live in devices. It's a very mutual ecosystem. 

By all been a lively chat thanks

CEO

@MS243: but should it cut you off if you can't follow the line without weaving due to an old war injury?

But the store's AI system would be able to query your AI / AR system and understand things like this

@MS423 - with things like Google Shopping Express and Amazon Prime / Fresh, it's a wonder that people still go to stores, really. I, personally, enjoy the experience of shopping. But in times where you are too busy at work or anything else to go to a furniture store, navigate it, and pick out the right thing, it's nice to know you can just order it and will show up in two days at your house. 

Is AR an app for the broader tech of embedded vision? I see co-located with AWE next week is the Embedded Vision Summit (http://www.embedded-vision.com/summit/may2014/conference) where Facebook and Google researchers will keynote.

Author

@Dr Thomas: Which I appreciate, being German ;)

I've had many a fine Brown Ale in Munich ... now you are making me thirsty!!!

I go out of my way to find stores without all the electronics and ad men jamming crap down your throat

Manager

Max - " the store can be popping things up" I can see that.

Blogger

WILL THE STORE BARR YOU ENTRY IF YOUR CREDIT IS INSUFFICIENT "That would put a dent on window shopping"

CEO

@DariaG - have you seen our Edge-Based tracking Daria? We've had a lot of success with it. It will be on display at AWE. 

@Dr Thomas: I think most grocery stores in the states already make it *very* clear where to find the beer.

I think I can hear one calling my name as we speak :-)

Other AR news this week was Google buying the Word Lens (augmented reality translation) app.

Manager

@sheepdoll: Are you familure with Acoustic Holography?

No, but I'll be looking it up after this chat LOL

re: retail AR

More importantly, I think AR should go towards transforming the process of purchasing things at retail stores. No more checkouts, no more lines- similar to how Apple or Nordstrom Rack does purchasing, but with a computer vision component. 

@Rick I expect some breakthrough in tracking technology. Cause only low quality of the most augmented reality solutions by now keeps augmented reality still far from consumers and slows down its popularity.

 

Rookie

@Max- I think most grocery stores in the states already make it *very* clear where to find the beer. Which I appreciate, being German ;)

@Duane: I don't think stores want that.

Maybe not, but if one store offers it and another doesn;t, which store do you think will get the customers? The thing is that while you are following your AR "guide" to the beer ... the store can be popping things up like "look at this amazing sale item"

@Max -- but should it cut you off if you can't follow the line without weaving due to an old war injury?

Manager

@duane, @controlfreak: It depends on the store- as online shopping divides the revenue between in-store and at home, big-box retailers want ways of influencing purchasing decisions and engaging with customers. I recently looked at a big-box retailers internal statistical evaluation of their stores and it was astounding how many customers, arriving with the intent of buying something, left without purchasing anything because they couldn't get the right information. 

@Max -  Are you familure with Acoustic Holography?  One one pole it is what makes surrround sound in theater work.  Another  pole in liquids it can be used for non distructive testing.   The microwave version was what I think was the core of the scanners TSA was wanting that can see through clothing.  (or replace virtually one's clothing with a different outfit on the monitor device.)

Blogger

@controlfreak: not just finding a store, but giving me a real-time map of the inventory?

Of course.... I can imagine that when you walk into a store it downloads a "map" into youtr AR system ... then all you hav eto do is say "Where can I find the beer" (your AR systen will recognize your voice) and a dotten line will appear on the floor in front of you...

Store maps -- one of the chain's in the midwest was doing an app for their stores

Manager

@Max: Great!

@controlfreak: Definitely. Indoor navigation and accessing information from products in store is one of the definitive use cases for AR. 

@Duane: you'd be surprised how much stores want that ;) 

Controlfreak - I don't think stores want that. They prefer that you have to browse past a lot of other items to get to what you want. I'd like such a system though - especially if I could put my list in and have it map the quickest route.

Blogger

@Dr Thomas: I think you have our US Marketing director's contact already (Trak). He would be the best person to contact for scheduling.

I just emailed him and asked him to set something up :-)

@Duane : Very James Bond

CEO

I am a novice, but do any of you see this being used to improve a shopping experience; not just finding a store, but giving me a real-time map of the inventory? I know the layout of my local supermarket, but when I go to Florida to visit my daughter, a shopping trip in anunfamiliar store makes me feel like a rat in a maze zig-zagging all over the place. I just want to tell a system what I need and have it map out the most effiecient route within the store to complet my list.

Rookie

@Thomas : At some point it's just semantic, right?

True :-) Although I like Alan Craig's definition "a medium in which digital information is overlaid on the physical world that is in both spatial and temporal registration with the physical world and that is interactive in real time". Other opinions may vary :-)

Manager

Max - I'm looking at building a silent personal communcations system - augmented personal communications, if you will. Nerfarous people would use it for cheating at cards.

Blogger

@Rick- they announced something earlier this week regarding SLAM, called "smart terrain" I believe. They've got a great team over there. 

@Duane: If it's not visual, can it still be called augmented reality?

Yes yes yes -- AR refers to anything that augments the real world -- it coudl be sound, touch, smell, taste, or vision

In one of my blogs I talked about some company using ultrasonics -- multiple beams meet/interfear at your fingertips to make it appear as though you are touching something

Qualcomm was doing a fair amount of AR work but I havent heard much from them lately on it.

Author

@Sheepdoll: At some point it's just semantic, right? There are many ongoing jokes regarding "augmented reality" & first having experienced it in college ;) 

@Sheepdoll: Reading has to be augmented reality as it changes reality in time

CEO

@DariaG: We were talking--among other things--about what you expect to see at the AWE event in Silicon Valley next week. Any ideas?

Author

@Daria: Thanks! Welcome!

@Rick: extremely nascent- this is one of those times we were are likely way ahead of any applied use-case, consumer or enterprise. But in addition to concentrating on improving the core AR tech for today, we have our eyes on 5 years from now. It's also a move on our part to help encourage device manufacturerers and sensor companies that this technology could be useful moving forward. 

Reading is most certantly augmented reality. Are reading and storytelling augmented reality?

 

Blogger

@Duane, re MF  -- I work security, so I am invisible.  One year as an attendee I felt I knew 500 to 1000 people at the event, Center of the storm in a way.   Almost any direction I look there I see somone I know.  (Unless it is the person I am looking for.)

Blogger

@Duane: If it's not visual, can it still be called augmented reality?


Most certainly- but we tend to refer to AR experiences that don't require real-time rendering as "computer vision", which is really utilizing any of the sensors (including the camera) to access information or trigger actions. Image recognition and visual search is a very good example of this. Also using sensors like GPS (the Nokia example mentioned earlier) is a popular form of Computer Vision. 

@Duane : to a blind person touch is certainly augmented reality

CEO

@Duane Benson : If it's not visual, can it still be called augmented reality?

In my opinion, absolutely!

Manager

@Thomas Alt: It looks like a very nascent area of many different headsets and content platforms and no clarity yet on which hw and sw to develop for/on

Author

@Rick - Daniel Kurz, the engineer in charge of the project, is already composing a draft for you, Rick! We should have it to you shortly, though AWE is certainly a resource-occupier. 

Hello everyone! This is Daria Gaioshko from Augmented Pixels. I am a bit late today. Let me see what are you discussing right now.

@Dr Thomas: Congratulations on "thermal touch". Sounds really exciting!

 

Rookie

@Max - I would enjoy that. I'm currently in our San Francisco office, and will be at AWE all next week. Friday would probably work best for me. I think you have our US Marketing director's contact already (Trak). He would be the best person to contact for scheduling. 

If it's not visual, can it still be called augmented reality? What about haptic signaling?

Blogger

The Metaio "Thernal Touch" prototype is interesting, but as they say 5 years out or so. I talked with Trak Lord about it and asked if one of Metaio's researchers could blog about their work on it.

Author

@Max the blibverts were the warning given by the programme ie sensory overload, is this a problem in real use?

CEO

@Rick: Besides silicon acceleration, what do we need in tech to get to consumer AR?

Content. There needs to be compelling content to bring the consumer back to the experience consistently. But the Catch 22 is that the hardware needs to improve to allow for "Always On" experiences. Then of course we need wearable devices to be more powerful (and quite frankly, more fashionable). So there are a lot of things happening in parallel. For our part, we are trying to improve the software and the algorithms in order to make sure that the experience itself works reliably.

Sheepdoll - I was looking for Neal, from OSHPark, too. I thought he was going to have a booth, but I didn't find it.

Blogger

I have a cybermaxx headset from about 15 or so years back.  (This is what the sub operator was using in the opening scene of the movie titanic.)   I still want to know why this sort of thing fades in and out of fasion.

 

Blogger

@Grusty: We would have to call you Max Headroom

I just knew someone was going to go there LOL

Tha twas a BRILLIANT program!!!

@Dr Thomas: For anyone who hasn't seen the video (shameless plug), here's more on Thermal Touch...

This is very interesting -- maybe you and I could arrache to have a conf call sometime next week (it's a holiday here on Monday)

Re: testing AR

We tend to benchmark our technology on a few factors like latency & inaccuracy, and we benchmark our hardware efforts on initialazation speeds and battery consumption

I can see it now -- people who want to get away from AR will have lifelike rubber masks made -- so they can be annomous in public

Manager

Sheepdoll - I didn't end up seeing anyone I know, even though there were probably a dozen folks I know there.

Blogger

Hi all, hope i'm not too late!

@ThomasAlt: Besides silicon acceleration, what do we need in tech to get to consumer AR?

 

Author

@Thomas : Wearable Headsets in the future will be a big part of this

I agree - this is an important development

Manager

Coincicentally I just got a newsletter from a headhunter and it was discussing the tech skills most in demand. Here's #1 on the list

1) Augmented reality developer
This position may sound space age, but many of today's companies have an urgent need for IT workers with augmented reality skills, mostly due to their part in popular mobile applications.

"Although augmented reality apps run the gamut from interactive map overlays and virtual showrooms to massive multiplayer king of the hill titles and the like, each piece of software hones in on smartphone GPS and camera functionality to create a more immersive experience," explained Digital Trends.

The typical salary for this type of developer is anywhere from $115,000 to $130,000 USD (~$125,000 to $141,000 CAD).

Blogger

@MeasurementBlues : How do you test augmented reality?

In the technical sense it's similar to other sensory/multimedia-type technologies. From a product or consumer perspective the effectiveness is derived from engagement levels. AR is primarily a communications medium (like print or cinema), although it obviously depends on a lot of sophisticated tech.

Manager

Max has too much headroom already.

@Max: I want to have the AR info made available to me without any effort on my part...

This is very much somethign we are trying to achieve at Metaio. AR needs to be as natural as possible, and it's likely that Wearable Headsets in the future will be a big part of this.

Speaking of pinball,  One of the most impressive haptic demos was at an atmel sponcered event.  A little box with a cellphone display.  The marble really felt like it was bumping off the edges and pillars. 

Blogger

@Garcia: Hi all -- sorry for being a bit late!

Hi Javi -- we have one of your countrymen from Barcelona here -- Pablo

@max without any effort on my part...

No Max dont do it, don't become a wire in the brain head. WE would have to call you Max Headroom.

CEO

@Max - Of course. AR however is essentially powered by the same data. It's really just a platform for managing the bridge between the real world and the physical world. Since there's no real "AR Hub" (yet), the AR would go away as soon as the infrastructure (Internet, Carriers, databases) were no longer available. 

I do think there's some possibility in the future for scalable Computer Vision libraries and architecture. Imagine something along the lines of a cloud system where you could store thousands of images, virtual content and other associated content that would automatically tie in to your experience, whatever it was. 

If that happens, then yes, that would be a very sore loss for people and companies involved if it were to go away. 

@Pablo: Max, here is a short video of the Mobile Center

Very interesting -- but I don't want to have to look at the world via a smartphone or a tablet -- I want to have the AR info made available to me without any effort on my part...

Hi all

Late to the party as well.

Blogger

Crusty here /, late today

CEO

For anyone who hasn't seen the video (shameless plug), here's more on Thermal Touch: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1HmYNqp8NM

@Dr Thomas: if the technological apocalypse arrives, I doubt AR will be what we miss most :)

I agree -- survival will be first and foremost -- but...

We had some big storm shere recently -- on TV the local news was talking abouit possible tornadoes and plotting their courses and saying "Harvest, it will be hitting you at 6:22pm ... Monrovia, it will pass you at 6:24pm ... Hazel Green, watch oiut at 6:32pmmm...."


I can't imagine not having this data available. But a few years ago you wouldn;t even have known a storm wa scoming until it arrived. Once you get used to information it's hard to live without it -- that will go for AR also

Went to a mini Maker Faire last month on Cape Cod, Mass.

Article on trust being more important that technology

Manager

@Rick and of course, Metaio will be showcasing some very cool Automotive AR demonstrations and R&D like Thermal Touch and real-time dynamic occlusion, such as the ability to place objects in the real world with depth and relation to other objects. 

@ Duane - You were at Maker Faire?  I guess with 40 to 50K attendees one can not see everyone.   I did see the pinball trailer, looked for Jeri but never did see her this year.  Usually she is hard to miss.

Blogger

@Rick what do you expect to see at AWE that could move the ball forward on this emerging area?

There's a lot of innovation coming from the Enterprise, and there are some really bright people involved in making wearable devices. The Enimai "Nod", a time-of-flight ring sensor is one of the most innovative things I've seen recently. 

Project Tango also has a lot of promise. 

How do you test augmented reality? We test guys don't care what it does, just how to make sure it's doing that you expect.

Sorry I'm late folks. I almost bought a Nokia Windows phone for its augmented reality Here! overlay that shows local restaurants and such through your phone camera.

Rookie

On the subject of hardware acceleration, there's also initiatives like Google's Project Tango https://www.google.com/atap/projecttango/

Manager

Max - I knew CastAR had split out of Valve software, but I didn't realize they got blessing and a lot of support from Gabe Newell (one of Valve's co-founders)

Blogger

@dtrainor: Which implies that augmenting content continually available and compelling.

Well, yes. I think it;s a bit like the Internet. Can you remember the early days. I recall when someone put the Paris metro timetable up on the Internet and we all thought "What an amazingly useful idea" LOL

When full-up AR comes along, people will be out-doing eachother to provide AR content that demands our attention.

I am a big fan of Stereo-3D photography.  Something I have done for 30 years.  It seems to cycle as the NBT every 5 to 8 years.  At the moment it seems to be in the downslope phase of the fad.

Blogger

Jeri Ellsworth, good interview

http://www.youtube.com/user/jeriellsworth

@Thomas Alt: What do you expect to see at AWE that could move the ball forward on this emerging area?

Author

@Rick, @Max - you both write for an engineering-centric publication, so I'm wondering what your opinions, insights and observations of AR have been recently- what stands out to you? Where do you see that technology going? 

She wasn't at their booth at Maker Faire when I stopped in, but I got to chat a bit with one of their employees, and I got a nice demo.

Blogger

@Dr Thomas: Hi Everyone- sorry I am a bit late.

Hi there -- welcome aboard!

@Duane: If CastAR is there, take a look.

I'm hoping to get an intervire with Jeri Ellsworth (creater of CastAR) in the not-so-distant future

@All- AWE is May 27-29, Expo and sessions start the 28, it's in Santa Clara, CA at the Santa Clara convention center

Hi all -- sorry for being a bit late!

Blogger

@Rick we have long-standing relationships with companies like Intel and NVIDIA, and from their public announcements it's no secret that they are heavily involved in camera technology (re: RealSense)

@Thomas - Wil anyone else be attending the Augmented World Expo (AWE)?

I will be there 27th-28th!

Manager

@Rick- that's something that we really can't disclose at this time, but the answer, long-term, is that we've seen a decided increase in the interest of device manufacturers / OEM in computer vision and AR as not only a USP but a worthwhile technology for user.

Great acronym, AWE, when and where?

Blogger

@Pablo: I do believe AR is great for rerailers.

I think that will be a big market -- both when you are inside a store and when you are simply walking down a road -- using AR to tell you about the types of stores, and about special offers, and suchlike -- but I also think thta AR is going to go far beyond retail

Max - The positive irony is that, had I followed the GPS map (my original plan), I would have ended up in about an hour of traffic to get to expensive parking at Maker Faire. As it was, I navigated by fragments of poor memory and a few road signs. I ended up going the "wrong" way, which took me to free parking, a short five minute walk from the palce.

Blogger

I try not to use a GPS or map -- a compass and a notepad with a few directions usually are all I need to get somewhere  -- peoples names -- I have to admit, Facebook, and LinkedIn help there some

 

Manager

Wil anyone else be attending the Augmented World Expo (AWE)? 

@Thomas: Yes I know you developed some hardware accleration for ST-Ericsson before they went belly up...will anyone else take it to production?

 

Author

Max, here is a short video of the Mobile Center: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ibaw8wLPpRo

Just skip to time index 2:00

Blogger

@Max- if the technological apocalypse arrives, I doubt AR will be what we miss most :)

@Max : I think once we have true AR then it will be "always on"

Which implies that augmenting content continually available and compelling.

Manager

@controlfreak: Sorry I am late, I'll have to read the thread quickly.

Hi Dick -- glad to have you -- let us know when you've caught up

@Duane: It's a little scary how dependant I've become on it so quickly.

It really makes you think -- the more dependent we become on this stuff -- the harder the fall if it's ever taken away...

@Rick, and on the subject of "Always On" - the industry could benefit greatly from hardware acceleration.

I can see all the little hacker trolls, hacking the google glass data, at the local health club lockerroom's  -- one more gadget to pull the battery out of every time one goes to the gym

Manager

Hi Everyone- sorry I am a bit late. 

@MS243: It can come down to whether you consider AR as "always on" or not.

I think once we have true AR then it will be "always on" -- but we may want to jave controls that allow us to control the "level" to which we expose ourselves and to which we accept and reveal information...

Rick - If CastAR is there, take a look.

Blogger

Thinking about the DKP senario.  I suspect that it might be hard to tell AR from insanity or any other escapist patentable regulated intellectual property.  When I was little we were promised better living through chemistry, look where that lead.

Blogger

@Thomas Alt: What do you most want to see in hardware for AR?

Author

@Rick: I'm going to Augmented World Expo in Silicon Valley next week (http://augmentedworldexpo.com/) Any suggestions what the EE Times crowd would want to know from the event?


I want to hear everything!!!

I do believe AR is great for rerailers. One local brand, Desigual, have a few shops where customers can use their smartphones (provided with a special app) to explore the features of the products, and the design process behind them. They were featured at the Mobile World Congress.

Blogger

Hi everyone. Dick Henry from Upstate New York. Sorry I am late, I'll have to read the thread quickly.

Rookie

@Pablo: There is a great showroom of AR in the World Mobile Center here, they have a bunch of applications you can explore with a smartphone or tablet.

I would love to see that

@sheepdoll: I thought that is what the imoranta prognastication did

No, that just predicts whether or not she will be in a good mood (which she wonlt be if she ever finds out about it LOL)

 

I was recently driving around in the San Frisco area, of California. I had a brand new Android tablet with moving map for navigation.

This articular tablet was having some issues and stopped navigating at a few critical points. I felt quite helpless. I've been driving around in the same area off and on for decades, and when using a paper map, was always able to maintain some sense of situational awareness.

The GPS-based map has a whole lot more useful information and flexibility, which is why I use it. But, It's a little scary how dependant I've become on it so quickly.

Blogger

@MS243 - There can be "etiquette" issues to consider for sure. Although these already require consideration with existing imaging technologies. It can come down to whether you consider AR as "always on" or not.

Manager

I'm going to Augmented World Expo in Silicon Valley next week (http://augmentedworldexpo.com/) Any suggestions what the EE Times crowd would want to know from the event?

Author

having an AR system that could remind me this person is my wife would be really handy

I thought that is what the imoranta prognastication did,

Blogger

There is a great showroom of AR in the World Mobile Center here, they have a bunch of applications you can explore with a smartphone or tablet.

Blogger

@Pablo: I'm "really" in sunny Barcelona

Just the fact that we can have thsi sort of online conversation from opposite sides of the world would have been mind-blowing in the not-so-distant past...

I have a dreadful memory for names and faces -- people come up to me and say hi and I'm desperatly trying to remember where I've met them before -- having an AR system that could remind me this person is my wife would be really handy

Things are mostly good in the NorthWest. We're having one of the three or four weeks during the year that don't have rain

Blogger

Hi Max, I'm "really" in sunny Barcelona

Blogger

Hi Pablo -- where abouts are you hailing from?

Even the AR that's available today via Spartphones and Tablets is pretty amazing ... and it's just the tiny tip of the iceberg

I'll start off with the controversy -- what happens if you accidentally photograph the local drug kingpin, and then he want's to do something about it -- at your expense ---  there are some definate con's to the technology as well

Manager

I must admit that I am very excited by the thoought of Augmented Reality -- but I also don;t think we really understand just how far it may take us

@sheepdoll: Reality is as reality does.

LOL

Hi Duane -- how are things in the North West?

Reality is as reality does.

Blogger

@MeasurementBlues: Before we can discuss augmented reality, we shou'l figure out that reality is.

When you work that out, you tell me :-)

Hello there -- Happy Friday!!!

 

Before we can discuss augmented reality, we shou'l figure out that reality is.

Hello everyone. This is Dr. David Trainor from Sentireal. Looking forward to a good discussion!

Manager

Good morning- this is Dr. Thomas Alt from Metaio. How are you, Max? 

Our next live online chat will commence on Friday 23 May 2014 at 10:00 a.m. Pacific Time (1:00 p.m. Eastern Time). You'll have to work out your local time from these clues (you can always use this handy-dandy Time Zone Converter).

Your host will be Max Maxfield, and the topic of conversation will be anything and everything to do with Augmented Reality. As always, we will be following our usual practice of leaping from topic to topic with the agility of young, fearless mountain goats, so make sure you're wearing appropriate clothing!



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